View Full Version : Okay, opinion thread, why do I have a problem with this and what is your opinion

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11/23/2016 8:13pm,
I don't see any pavement or hardwood in these videos. And what do professional big purse tournaments have to do with these videos?

For a PhD you sure can't use an apostrophe correctly. Is your smart phone to blame?

One should always train and teach falling as if one were preparing for the real thing.

And I stand in awe of your superior apostrophe acumen.

We could not afford apostrophes when I went to school, so I never learned how to use them.

Omega Supreme
11/23/2016 8:42pm,
Huh, I never thought about making a head lock escape a priority.

Omega Supreme
11/23/2016 8:44pm,
In my opinion this was a better video:


11/23/2016 8:59pm,
Huh, I never thought about making a head lock escape a priority.

It's a classic Gracie Jiu-Jitsu assumption,
that in street fights,
headlocks both with punches and without,
are a common scenario,
and therefore useful to know how to survive, escape, and execute counter-offense from.

If nothing else, it might help one survive and escape a vicious noogie attack from big brother.
And it's a nice model that teaches some principles as well.

Headlocks in this case include standing headlocks with punches,
kesa gatame on the ground,
and variants where the adversary is using your head
and your broken posture as a leverage point to inflict control or punishment on you.

11/23/2016 9:16pm,
So what 10 techniques would you guys recommend?

Well, I think that learning how to control a person is very important. So, like osaekomi to start out (including back control, and ashi garami position/half guard), and linkage of basic ground movements (shrimp, bridging, hip escape, buck, log roll, back shoulder roll, front shoulder roll, etc) to escapes from said pins as well as from back control positions. But are those techniques?

Add basic submissions of choice (probably a cross collar choke, hadaka jime, Ude Garami, Ude Gatame, Juji Gatame, Sankaku Jime), and one closed guard break/pass, basic standing open guard pass, basic choke and armbar defense for whatever you chose, blah blah blah

I'm sure I left something out. For Judo, the list would be a bit different, but the focus on subs in BJJ changes things a bit.

That's a lot of stuff for a white belt, LOL.

I'd lean towards fewer "techniques" and towards linking positions to opportunity and how to move on the ground

11/23/2016 9:21pm,
Why is it "really, really bad". It's just a demo. They aren't actual breakfalls. They were pantomime. And what the hell is "ninja style".

Remember there can be only one, and you are not it.

Pship Destroyer
11/24/2016 12:23am,
Remember there can be only one, and you are not it.

Is there a reason you didn't bother answering a single question?

11/24/2016 2:29am,
Remember there can be only one, and you are not it.And he just got the red dot changed to a green one too.

Is there a reason you didn't bother answering a single question?This is a serious thread relating to training and such.

11/24/2016 3:07am,
Huh, I never thought about making a head lock escape a priority.

It does seem to be a staple in BJJ self-defense curriculum. Maybe because it is something a layperson is likely to go for?

Cake of Doom
11/24/2016 5:39am,
If you're going to get thrown into a forward roll, your legs are doing most of the work of the breakfall. So from a judo guy's pov, learning to get up with bent legs like that just builds bad habits for ukemi. Unless there's some other BJJ oriented point to that drill I don't understand...

The whole thing is so perfunctory as to be useless. May as well have made a bullet list with a note saying "find someone better than me to teach you these things".

That's how we learnt to come out of a roll in trad. JJ. It took ages to break the habit once I started Judo. Ages despite the fact that ending a roll in that manner, if you've been thrown with any sort of force, hurts and the moment can carry you forward causing more trouble than it's worth.

11/24/2016 5:42am,
Is there a reason you didn't bother answering a single question?

Ben has already donated his Judo expertise several times on this thread.

Volunteer participants are not beholden to answer every question nor accommodate every demand made to them over the Internet.

11/24/2016 7:44am,
My list.

1.- O Goshi
2.- Guard pull
3.- Headlock defense standing
4.- Standing guillotine
5.- Armbar from guard and mount
6-. Kimura from guard and side control
7.- Cross collar choke from guard and mount
8.- Rear naked choke
9.- Upa
10.- Scissor sweep

Of course shrimping, standing in base, rolling, bridging and falling. But these I see as required fitness/body education for grappling not as techniques; and as methods for increasing the white belts hate on the old guy leading the warmups.

Ed. There's no guard passing in the list and there should be a couple of passes, but that would be more than the 10 Omega asked,

11/24/2016 7:49am,
2. Standing in base (staggered...

If you dont mind, what 'staggered' means in this context?

11/24/2016 8:22am,
If you dont mind, what 'staggered' means in this context?

Square stance means both feet in line with the shoulders.

Staggered stance means there is a lead foot.

Both stances have a base and their own weak lines.

11/24/2016 8:33am,

11/24/2016 11:48am,
As a Sport Jiu-Jitsu practitioner it doesn't surprise me that there are some sloppy takedowns. While there are people at the club I train who haven't cross trained with some decent takedowns I've noticed that many Bjj players shoot from too far away and often telegraph their double. It's enough to have occasional success but against a Wrestler it's a recipe for disaster. I've always leaned towards a slightly more wrestling style rather than a Judo or Guard pulling approach so it's never been a massive issue for me- but it's a common issue for many in the community.

Don't get me wrong Sport focused Bjj has lead to refinements in a lot of areas for Jits in general and practitioners can certainly defend themselves far better than they could otherwise but they do leave themselves open and vulnerable in the process- which is why keeping the self defence approach alive is so important. I think the best thing you can teach a new white belt from a self defence perspective, without repeating what others have said by going into specifics, is how to defend themselves from punches on the bottom, how to retain guard and sweep and to close the distance and takedown an opponent- but all with the goal of standing up and running away via a technical stand up, not submission hunting, even if they are taught some basic locks and chokes for safe measure.