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RogueManatee
9/10/2016 5:34pm,
So I've been in judo for about a year now and my forward throws still suck. I mostly hit counter throws and sasae but need to find a forward throw I really want to stick with preferably one that I could use out of sport if I needed to. preferably one that is high percentage gi or no gi, against larger opponents (I'm 5'6) and that doesn't break my knees on concrete or rather is stable enough to stay standing preferably. Throws I have in mind are O Goshi, Seoi Nage, Tai Otoshi, Harai Goshi or Uchi Mata but am open to other suggestions.

I know I'm probably overthinking it and I should just "go with what works" but that's not really what I'm asking because I kinda suck at all of them equally (as in can't hit them in randori unless my opponent really sucks).

My current understanding is that they all have trade offs like seoi being worse no gi (and drop version not being safe off mats) or uchi mata being tough to pull off against bigger guys. Sorry if this is unclear but I'm still a noob.

Raycetpfl
9/10/2016 5:43pm,
So I've been in judo for about a year now and my forward throws still suck. I mostly hit counter throws and sasae but need to find a forward throw I really want to stick with preferably one that I could use out of sport if I needed to. preferably one that is high percentage gi or no gi, against larger opponents (I'm 5'6) and that doesn't break my knees on concrete or rather is stable enough to stay standing preferably. Throws I have in mind are O Goshi, Seoi Nage, Tai Otoshi, Harai Goshi or Uchi Mata but am open to other suggestions.

I know I'm probably overthinking it and I should just "go with what works" but that's not really what I'm asking because I kinda suck at all of them equally (as in can't hit them in randori unless my opponent really sucks).

My current understanding is that they all have trade offs like seoi being worse no gi (and drop version not being safe off mats) or uchi mata being tough to pull off against bigger guys. Sorry if this is unclear but I'm still a noob.

Which color is the best? I wanna paint my house. Please get back to me when you can.

which golf club is the best? I wanna play a round of golf and I need to know which club is the best.

HarshMallow
9/10/2016 6:43pm,
Which color is the best? I wanna paint my house. Please get back to me when you can.

which golf club is the best? I wanna play a round of golf and I need to know which club is the best.

Hey now. This isn't YMAS. I thought this was a "safe place".

And:
1) Pink or Calico.
2) Doesn't matter. Play wherever these ladies go: https://atlantastripper.com/golf-events.html

BackFistMonkey
9/10/2016 6:53pm,
Hey now. This isn't YMAS. I thought this was a "safe place".

And:
1) Pink or Calico.
2) Doesn't matter. Play wherever these ladies go: https://atlantastripper.com/golf-events.html

You are correct about the Basic and Misc. Fighting Technique Discussion forum being a "safe space".
But at the same time you are asking for an objective answer to a subjective question. I am pretty sure Rayce was attempting to say this without saying it. He gets minimalist and/or cryptic at times.

I think asking for peoples favorite, preferred, or proven techniques would get you better answers.

WFMurphyPhD
9/10/2016 6:59pm,
So I've been in judo for about a year now and my forward throws still suck. I mostly hit counter throws and sasae but need to find a forward throw I really want to stick with preferably one that I could use out of sport if I needed to. preferably one that is high percentage gi or no gi, against larger opponents (I'm 5'6) and that doesn't break my knees on concrete or rather is stable enough to stay standing preferably. Throws I have in mind are O Goshi, Seoi Nage, Tai Otoshi, Harai Goshi or Uchi Mata but am open to other suggestions.

I know I'm probably overthinking it and I should just "go with what works" but that's not really what I'm asking because I kinda suck at all of them equally (as in can't hit them in randori unless my opponent really sucks).

My current understanding is that they all have trade offs like seoi being worse no gi (and drop version not being safe off mats) or uchi mata being tough to pull off against bigger guys. Sorry if this is unclear but I'm still a noob.

First Advice: Ask your coach.

Second Advice: Ask your coach.

Third advice:

Post fun videos like this with your question, for comments

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92GZV-Mzg3Y

Then Summon the Bullshido Crotchety Spirit of Judo by also posting this video, and then watching it after you post your question to Summon the aforementioned Spirit:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRTJ2xVr0PA

Lindz
9/10/2016 7:30pm,
Post fun videos like this with your question, for comments

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=92GZV-Mzg3Y


I think I'm about to learn something. Is this a legit combo? How does it work? I've always thought of judo combos as trying to throw someone one way then taking advantage of their defence which moves them in the opposite (more or less) direction. But how does this one work? You pull him forward, fail for some reason then pull him further again, more?

HarshMallow
9/10/2016 7:36pm,
So I've been in judo for about a year now and my forward throws still suck. I mostly hit counter throws and sasae but need to find a forward throw I really want to stick with preferably one that I could use out of sport if I needed to. preferably one that is high percentage gi or no gi, against larger opponents (I'm 5'6) and that doesn't break my knees on concrete or rather is stable enough to stay standing preferably. Throws I have in mind are O Goshi, Seoi Nage, Tai Otoshi, Harai Goshi or Uchi Mata but am open to other suggestions.

I know I'm probably overthinking it and I should just "go with what works" but that's not really what I'm asking because I kinda suck at all of them equally (as in can't hit them in randori unless my opponent really sucks).

My current understanding is that they all have trade offs like seoi being worse no gi (and drop version not being safe off mats) or uchi mata being tough to pull off against bigger guys. Sorry if this is unclear but I'm still a noob.

What does your instructor suggest?

I'm your height and I like the *-goshi throws because it's usually no problem for me to get my hips lower than my opponents. I can toss my 380 pound classmate with O-goshi. The problem is, when we do randori he just drags me to the ground. My instructor said to use drop seoi-nage on him. You don't have to drop to your knees. You can crouch low as long as you are under him. This is also according to my instructor.

Note, I suck at judo. I'm just chiming in because I've been trying to figure out what throws will work for me also. I don't know enough to give an educated opinion.

I also like tani otoshi and sukui-nage but those are not forward throws. I just think they work OK for short people.

HarshMallow
9/10/2016 7:40pm,
You are correct about the Basic and Misc. Fighting Technique Discussion forum being a "safe space".
But at the same time you are asking for an objective answer to a subjective question. I am pretty sure Rayce was attempting to say this without saying it. He gets minimalist and/or cryptic at times.

I think asking for peoples favorite, preferred, or proven techniques would get you better answers.

I wasn't asking the question, but I agree with what you are saying anyway.

Maybe I am just feeling guilty for all of the ****-posting I've been doing in the women's self defense thread :-)

BackFistMonkey
9/10/2016 7:44pm,
I wasn't asking the question, but I agree with what you are saying anyway.

Maybe I am just feeling guilty for all of the ****-posting I've been doing in the women's self defense thread :-)

Ah yes I see now that you are not OP. My use of "you" was incorrect and you should feel bad about **** posting 6 posts in a row when you could easily have put them into one post.

WFMurphyPhD
9/10/2016 8:00pm,
I think I'm about to learn something. Is this a legit combo? How does it work? I've always thought of judo combos as trying to throw someone one way then taking advantage of their defence which moves them in the opposite (more or less) direction. But how does this one work? You pull him forward, fail for some reason then pull him further again, more?


Here is a close cousin for comparison from the same tori / uke:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_NzXQq1a8A&list=PLwqq0kSjKuhPvGeAMp9qJUQbB91Ri2S0u&index=7

After people brace out of a sasae or hiza,
they often have a natural inclination to move,
even if subtly to recalibrate their posture and balance.

If you watch,
Tori patiently allows Uke to attempt his next rebalancing little step after the failed sasae/hiza,
and Tori has kept his prior attack foot "floating",
waiting to step down the new line of Uke's feet,
placing Tori's floating foot relatively near Uke's newly planted foot,
Tori also uses his armwork to rotate Uke a bit,
putting Uke totally on Uke's stepping leg,
and then Tori sweeps Uke's newly planted leg out from under him,
while little or preferably no weight is now on Uke's other leg.

Whether it works or not is situational,
and depends a lot on practice, as with everything else.

This is definitely an action-reaction,
timing combination that requires confidence in the way of patience
to allow Uke's next subtle natural reaction to occur and to then be exploited.

But, Ben and the other Judo enthusiasts on the board may have other ideas about it.

RogueManatee
9/10/2016 8:02pm,
Hey at least I got some good martial artists to reply to a shitty topic. But I am aware it's a subjective question, thus I wanted subjective suggestions. I dunno maybe I'll just try hitting uchi mata (because it's cool) for the next few months and see if it sticks.

goodlun
9/10/2016 8:42pm,
I personally am a fan of Harai Goshi

Works well Gi or No Gi. Only have to pummel one hook in, works well enough on taller opponents.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KHvRDlp2jqI


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRNHFuNL0mc

How ever as other people have said you have to figure out what works well for you.

Guird
9/11/2016 4:01am,
I absolutely love, LOVE the basic hip throws. 70% of the time I that I take my opponent down it's with a hip throw. I find them the easiest forward throws to learn and execute, and very versatile. Against shorter opponents the over-the-head grip is easy to get, against taller ones the underhook is easy. These same grips are super easy to get from collar ties and over-under respectively.

I also feel like you have a lot of control over your opponent's fall, which is relevant to sparring with people who aren't all that experienced yet with falling, but also for application outside the dojo. A lot of throws can carry a serious risk of killing an untrained opponent on hard ground, but with the hip throw I feel like I have the choice of setting them down gently or slamming their torso to the floor with my weight on top. Related to this, provided they don't cling to you as you throw you have the option of staying standing or transitioning seamlessly into a kesa gatame/modified kesa gatame, holds which have additional violence scalability benefits. I've also seen people demonstrate smooth transitions into armbars/north south kimuras from well-executed hip throws, which I'm excited to try out.

I've even found myself using one variant of a hip throw (I think it would be uki-goshi?) to set up another variant (O-goshi)

if I would reccomend any throw to someone it would be the hip throw.

a grain of salt though- so far most of the time i've been applying this in a gi is in BJJ, where most of my partners aren't particularly good at the stand up and usually prefer to pull guard.

Guird
9/11/2016 4:01am,
double post

Bar Humbug
9/11/2016 6:59am,
Here is a close cousin for comparison from the same tori / uke:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7_NzXQq1a8A&list=PLwqq0kSjKuhPvGeAMp9qJUQbB91Ri2S0u&index=7


Just to add on, a personal favourite of mine is Hiza Garuma (lapel side leg, off an over the shoulder shoulder grip)---> Uchi Mata (trade out for any koshi waza really), found that with a little adjustment it works reasonably well in no-gi/mma too, especially Uchi as people really aren't expecting to be thrown.

Oh, and to OP: don't count off Seoi Otoshi's, if I had a pound for every time I've heard someone say that my knees will spontaneously combust/explode/baby rabbits will cry etc. if I do them in randori, I would be a rich man.

Plus it allows me to post this awesome vid

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSa0trHYLjI

MisterMR
9/11/2016 9:39am,
DISCLAIMER: I'm an amateur, so read at your risk!

I've never been in a situation of self defence (nor I plan or want to be). The most similar situation in which I found myself is: trying to throw in a Nippon Kempo match/sparring (as NK has also punches and kicks).

In this limited experience of mine, the best way to throw is to get very close to the opponent, eg. by walking forward on every punch, and then clinch. I've seen people grabbing an incoming punch and throwing directly in seoi nage (in some competitions), but I would never be able to do it as it requires awesome reflexes, the "clinch and throw" is much more reliable imho.

For this reason, in NK I favour techniques that are easy to do from clinch: hip technques forward (haray goshi, koshi guruma etc.)whereas backward o soto gari, ko soto gari/gake, sometimes tani otoshi, etc.

The main problem for me is not "what technique", but rather "how do I grab him", the technique is a consequence of where/how I grab.