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IkeH
10/02/2013 7:06pm,
Torn cartilage in both wrists. Developing carpal tunnel.

RSI in both elbows as well as shitloads of scar tissue.

Talked to me doctor and he said that any high-impact stuff was out, and any upper-body weightlifting was out.

So I'll never be muscular, and I'll never be able to fight. It's like starting to drive me insane.

Has anyone else been in this situation? How can I feel good about myself if I can't lift or train?

The Cap
10/02/2013 9:18pm,
I'm there with you man. Torn meniscus bad enough that it required surgery, which didn't come until 8 months after the injury. Started getting back to the gym three weeks ago and tore the meniscus on the other side trying to compensate for the original. Haven't worked out proper in a year now.

Inactivity is one of the cruellest killers man can know. It starts from the body but takes the mind, and leaves a shell for the audience to remember one by. Those on the periphery can so easily be pushed away and, if they might notice something's awry, can only wonder at what is missing.

I don't know what the answer is here. Horrifyingly, it's when you come to that crucial stage of grief, the acceptance, that you know it's beaten you. Here is a calamity you should always fight instead of mourn, but what then when the grief is born because one can't fight? Hell is not other people. Hell is the person we are when we're torn from that which we thought defined us.

The only way out is to find something new to make of yourself. Here: swim. Swim until you learn to move like some goddamned gill-breathing mammal-fish in the water. Do it even though you tell yourself you hate getting wet. Do it even though you'd rather be grieving lost dreams. It's better to live off any fuel but grief.

The doctor said my legs are going to get better. Never one-hundred percent, but better. I'll be getting on a spin bike soon and I'm going to leave this inactivity crap behind. Come join me.

STFU and swim.

IkeH
10/02/2013 10:56pm,
That was beautiful man, thanks.

1point2
10/04/2013 3:34am,
Second opinion, second opinion, second opinion. Second opinion from a *sports* doctor. From a doctor who is interested in fixing problems in order to make you more capable again, instead of just saying you'll never X again.

A lot of docs don't have the motivation or skillset to get someone back to 100% again. There are doctors who will say that all of athletics--running, Olympic lifting, soccer, football, powerlifting, volleyball, mountain climbing--is unsafe and should be avoided because it uses more than one muscle at a time. Eff that noise. We are not here in this lifetime to avoid all possibility of danger.

There are doctors who will look at your problems and your goals and try to help you get back to the condition where you can train strength and fighting. There are doctors who will tell you to give those things up. Find the doctors who will help you instead of send you out to pasture. It's reasonable to say high-impact activities and upper-body lifting are out for now, but what's the plan to get you back in a month, three months, a year?

MikeD81
10/04/2013 6:17am,
Definitely agree with 1point2. Try and get some recommendations for a doctor who has trained in sports medicine, they will generally take a better view towards getting you back to what you want to do rather than just ruling things out.

But yeah I know exactly how you feel - I spent most of last year on the shelf with cam impingement in my hip (it was so bad sitting down felt like someone was shoving a hot kinife into my hip). And had a 24 month period where I managed to break or dislocate 5 fingers and had to have surgery on two of them.

So yeah advice wise I guess the best thing I found was doing something that I could manage that didn't stir things up to much (running with a broken thumb is a lot harder than you'd think it would be) and start there. I used to hate running and finally came to actually enjoy it. Then I did my hip, and now I'm finding that starting to run again is a whole lot worse than running ever was...

Mister
10/04/2013 7:29am,
I feel for you bro.

You're only beaten if you give up.

Look into sprinting and becoming real fast and well conditioned.

Will save your life someday, likely more than martial arts will.

Vieux Normand
10/04/2013 12:15pm,
Just a suggestion: there may be a middle ground between trying to go back to doing exactly what you did in the past and giving up entirely.

There's more than one way to fight. Some ways are effective at certain stages in your life, other ways may be more effective at other stages.

Nothing is permanent--injuries and just general aging will remind you of that reality, handing you a choice between adapting to what has occurred or not adapting and just fucking yourself up even more...or giving up entirely. Try door number one, and be methodical and patient about it.

Being over 50 and basically a walking wreck (but still training and working at a job requiring some use-of-force...though differently than I did years and decades ago), I know whereof I speak. Some of my injuries have left me permanently disfigured, but I have to put food on the table.

You may not need to give up what you did--just change the way that you do it.

CapnMunchh
10/04/2013 2:16pm,
Just a suggestion: there may be a middle ground between trying to go back to doing exactly what you did in the past and giving up entirely.

There's more than one way to fight. Some ways are effective at certain stages in your life, other ways may be more effective at other stages.

Nothing is permanent--injuries and just general aging will remind you of that reality, handing you a choice between adapting to what has occurred or not adapting and just fucking yourself up even more...or giving up entirely. . . .

Being over 50 and basically a walking wreck (but still training and working at a job requiring some use-of-force...though differently than I did years and decades ago), I know whereof I speak. Some of my injuries have left me permanently disfigured, but I have to put food on the table.

I agree 100%. Sooner or later, we all get old and more physically vulnerable. I'm in my 60's and have had to learn to adapt if I want to keep practicing MA. That meant giving up BJJ, which I loved dearly. At this point, you at least have a chance of recovering some ability, and/or are young enough to find other means to train your body.

Eventually we all lose everything, so appreciate what you still have left, and prepare yourself, for the day will come when you will have even less. Sorry, I know it sucks to hear it, but its the truth.

Definitely talk to another doctor, or two. Also, have you considered firearms training? There's a reason why soldiers and cops don't fight empty handed.

Diesel_tke
10/07/2013 2:01pm,
I'm there with you man. Torn meniscus bad enough that it required surgery, which didn't come until 8 months after the injury. Started getting back to the gym three weeks ago and tore the meniscus on the other side trying to compensate for the original. Haven't worked out proper in a year now.

Inactivity is one of the cruellest killers man can know. It starts from the body but takes the mind, and leaves a shell for the audience to remember one by. Those on the periphery can so easily be pushed away and, if they might notice something's awry, can only wonder at what is missing.

I don't know what the answer is here. Horrifyingly, it's when you come to that crucial stage of grief, the acceptance, that you know it's beaten you. Here is a calamity you should always fight instead of mourn, but what then when the grief is born because one can't fight? Hell is not other people. Hell is the person we are when we're torn from that which we thought defined us.

The only way out is to find something new to make of yourself. Here: swim. Swim until you learn to move like some goddamned gill-breathing mammal-fish in the water. Do it even though you tell yourself you hate getting wet. Do it even though you'd rather be grieving lost dreams. It's better to live off any fuel but grief.

The doctor said my legs are going to get better. Never one-hundred percent, but better. I'll be getting on a spin bike soon and I'm going to leave this inactivity crap behind. Come join me.

STFU and swim.

^This^

I'm sure you have checked into a second opinion. I tore my ACL and meniscus a little over a year ago. I did the rehab and PT and got through everything. The doc told me that I was good to go back to training. So I went back. Then about a month later I started having knee pain again. So I backed off and tried to take it easy. Eventually had to get another MRI where the doctor told me that the spot where th meniscus was taken out has caused a defect in the bone. Now I'm limited to no exertional activities, I was given an unloader brace, and told I can get another surgery. Yippee! Unfortunately I am not at the position now, where I can get the other surgery. So I'm out of training.

So I have done what The Cap has recomended. I've taken up biking. Road biking, mountain biking, spinning...whatever involves a bike, I'm doing it. And it has allowed me to not be so depressed about lack of training. I'm still doing Tai Chi, and some stick forms with my kids, but alive sparring is out. I've also been able to bike with my family, which is fun. I'm stoked to get to incorperate them into this process. So it is what it is. But as long as you keep moving forward, you will be good.

Mister
10/07/2013 2:27pm,
How did you guys tear your menisci and/or ACL?

Just curious.

The Cap
10/07/2013 5:01pm,
Determined to recover and checking in. I'm leaving for physio in fifteen minutes and taking an hour out of my morning tomorrow to spin and do chin ups. How's the pool Ike?



How did you guys tear your menisci and/or ACL?

At the gym with a cold trying to beat my squat max. Wasn't strong enough to maintain form and rotational force was applied to my knee joint.

Mister
10/07/2013 6:22pm,
At the gym with a cold trying to beat my squat max. Wasn't strong enough to maintain form and rotational force was applied to my knee joint.

Damn, I always thought squatting was safe.

The Cap
10/08/2013 2:14pm,
Damn, I always thought squatting was safe.

It still is. There's inherent risk to any physical activity, but less so in squatting than in many others. I had too much weight on my back for my condition and no spotter that day.

sweats
10/08/2013 7:27pm,
Sorry man. Unfortunately, we all have our athletic expiration dates. I hope I'm wrong, but I figure I have a couple more years left to do BJJ. My neck and back aren't feeling so great anymore after a few decades of punishment and I hurt significantly (not in a good muscle soreness way either) after training.

I've seen people go a few different ways when facing the end of their martial arts/athletic careers depending on their circumstances. Some switch arts, cut way down on the training in terms of frequency or intensity, and others find a peripheral way to be involved (coach, do administrative things, etc.). For me, I'll probably make a clean break. The intensity and exertion has always been the fun part and anything less will just remind me of what I'm not doing.

At that point, I'll just have to find something else to fill my time with. I probably should be devoting more time to career development and getting some professional certifications. The wife and I have talked about designing and building a house somewhere a bit more rural.

Diesel_tke
10/09/2013 9:21am,
How did you guys tear your menisci and/or ACL?

Just curious.

I was sparring, full contact stick fighting. Every range from stick to grapling. I was about a minute into a round, mostly staying on the outside. But I came in to close and had to do a roofblock to avoid a stick to the head, my natural tendency after a roof block is to clench. So I clenched and then got a takedown ending in the half mount. The guy on the bottom put me in Eddie Bravo's "lockdown". But he wasn't trying to get out of it. I should have been content to stay there and do strikes, but I tried to move to the mount. My right leg was lockeddown around the calf. So I moved to a kind of knee on belly position, which I have used in the past. It puts a lot of pressure on your rib cage so usually you release the lockdown position and try to scramble into full guard. So I did that, but he bridged a little bit. So I leaned to the right to keep from being swept. As I did that I twisted my leg a little more than I should and I heard a loud POP! Then lost strength in my leg. The result was fully torn ACL and meniscus. I got an ACL reconstruction and 2/3rds of my meniscus taken out. Also ended with a defect in my medial femoral condyle. My work was done at the Andrews Institute.

Now I have also develped Plantar Fasciitis in my foot on the other leg. Fun!

Sang
10/10/2013 9:10pm,
Feel your pain. I've been out of training for 3 months with a ruptured disk with no sign of recovery. Haven't been good company to be around.