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berni29
7/14/2011 8:02pm,
Hi There

I am a Chunner and agree with the majority sentiment in this thread. I am no Chun expert by any means but I have trained Chun in the UK, Singapore and HK and people do spar, but not in a conventional sense. I am talking about Chi Sau and it can get very physical. Because you are not using any protective gear you do have to exercise a lot of control. I have had a few badly controlled chops to the neck and throat before now (for example) and it is unpleasant to say the least. Having said that no worse than an over enthusiastic arm bar in a BJJ class. A lot of Chun schools, especially in HK where I am now, discourage any moves that can easily cause injury. So not much elbow stuff or kicking to the knees etc. I guess it relates to a fear of litigation or being presented with medical bills. Also classes in HK seem to be a lot less structured than they could be so it is the lazy option to omit the stuff that needs close supervision.

All the best

Berni

The Juggernoob
7/14/2011 8:08pm,
I am talking about Chi Sau and it can get very physical. Because you are not using any protective gear you do have to exercise a lot of control. I have had a few badly controlled chops to the neck and throat before now (for example) and it is unpleasant to say the least. Having said that no worse than an over enthusiastic arm bar in a BJJ class.

All the best

Berni

Ok, so now lets compare that to actually getting punched in muay thai and kickboxing for the past 6 years, actually getting thrown in Judo and actually having the tendons in my knee torn by an over excited polish bouncer in a BJJ class.

Go **** yourself.

It is Fake
7/14/2011 8:32pm,
Hi There

I am a Chunner and agree with the majority sentiment in this thread. I am no Chun expert by any means but I have trained Chun in the UK, Singapore and HK and people do spar, but not in a conventional sense. I am talking about Chi Sau and it can get very physical. Because you are not using any protective gear you do have to exercise a lot of control. I have had a few badly controlled chops to the neck and throat before now (for example) and it is unpleasant to say the least. Having said that no worse than an over enthusiastic arm bar in a BJJ class. A lot of Chun schools, especially in HK where I am now, discourage any moves that can easily cause injury. So not much elbow stuff or kicking to the knees etc. I guess it relates to a fear of litigation or being presented with medical bills. Also classes in HK seem to be a lot less structured than they could be so it is the lazy option to omit the stuff that needs close supervision.

All the best

BerniChi Sau is not sparring. It leads to terrible bullshit like this:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixkSpVtLUcw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIxFIi1OBzs

berni29
7/14/2011 11:10pm,
Hi Juggernoob,

Yes, thats the thing, it does not compare to getting hit in the head or thrown regularly. I have ended up on this forum because I am trying to find my way and work out what I need to be doing, or at least to know that what I am doing is worthwhile in the context of being effective in an unscripted situation.

My work does not let me see pic and vids in the links so I will have to check out the above when back at home.

Tks for the input guys.........

Berni

Syphilis
7/15/2011 2:56am,
So according to the first video, in competition Wing Chun, you play pattycake while you throw knees to the body?

???

bobyclumsyninja
7/15/2011 3:40am,
No foot to the boys...he was beggin for it, in that second vid.

@ berni, welcome to Bullshido. It's nice to have you, consider an introduction in newbietown. Not required, but it's a loving place. Click on the spoiler at the bottom of my signature for helpful advice for Bullshido beginners.
http://www.bullshido.net/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=64 <<<< newbietown.

As for your goals to improve your chun, if you're aiming to take it into any highly alive setting, wearing pads is a great idea. To practice something hard enough to actually hurt someone, without hurting training partners, requires padding, unless everything gets pulled, but in that case, how can anyone attain the muscle memory, to do it all out, on demand?

Also, losing the triangle stance is key, in my opinion. Most people don't stand like that, when really pressured, so why train like anyone would? Were they to, tackling is quite possibly imminent, and no elbow to the spine is likely to change that. That or the knee/foot/fist to the boys.

I got shin kicked in the temple (not d3adly...ha!) grappling Strikestanian (another poster/ammy mma fighter) fairly recently. We weren't even throwing hands, or striking at all....but I got a nice bubble-welt, for a few days. We kept going after a moment, and he continued to school-wtf-pwn me into a sub. Good Tymes.
**** (injuries) happen(s)

@IIF, that 2nd vid failed so hard, the lights went off in my room. It looks fun, but wtf for martial? more like marital.

philmgriffin
7/15/2011 4:08am,
Chi Sau is not sparring. It leads to terrible bullshit like this:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixkSpVtLUcw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FIxFIi1OBzs

Arghhhhh, stop trying to hit each other and throw a real fecking punch!!

On the plus side though you get to meet hot chicks and almost touch them...

bobyclumsyninja
7/15/2011 4:17am,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4EO9nDdhx1A


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aSAsxPEP7Tk&NR=1

philmgriffin
7/15/2011 4:30am,
Jesus H Christ, what's wrong with you man? FFS just park somewhere else, you live in a terrible neighborhood! I'm just glad that all of the car thieves are so easily killed/knocked out with a mixture of manners and foom foom foom.

It is Fake
7/15/2011 8:34am,
There's an entire thread on this guy. Hey was the one that got the bullshido video account pulled from youtube IIRC.

berni29
7/15/2011 9:19am,
Hi

Some of those vids are really quite funny, but I would say that the guys and girl doing the Chi Sau competition stuff are at least putting themselves out there and having a go.

As for the two Chunners doing the demos yes, it is pretty unrealistic, but they are trying to get a message across. Personally I would say that both guys are skilful and can in all probability fight pretty hard for real if they had to. I wish I was as fast.

As an aside, I did actually train for one of those Chi Sau competitions once although I did not end up competing. The training was good fun and much more realistic than a lot that goes on at WC school so it probably should be encouraged.

And on the triangle stance, that is a training stance, most chunners will have one foot forwards with either 50/50 weight distribution or a bit more on the back foot. Some a lot more on the back foot.

All the best

Berni

It is Fake
7/15/2011 9:31am,
Hi

Some of those vids are really quite funny, but I would say that the guys and girl doing the Chi Sau competition stuff are at least putting themselves out there and having a go. Nope, this logic has helped to stigmatize Chinese Martial Arts.



he training was good fun and much more realistic than a lot that goes on at WC school so it probably should be encouraged. Learning how to spar and fight wrong is incorrect no matter how much fun it is and it should not be encouraged.

philmgriffin
7/15/2011 9:37am,
There's an entire thread on this guy. Hey was the one that got the bullshido video account pulled from youtube IIRC.

think I found it now Sifu Justin Och right? he got the bullshido account pulled, what an ass!

It is Fake
7/15/2011 10:00am,
http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=89270&

The Juggernoob
7/15/2011 1:14pm,
Hi

Some of those vids are really quite funny, but I would say that the guys and girl doing the Chi Sau competition stuff are at least putting themselves out there and having a go.

As for the two Chunners doing the demos yes, it is pretty unrealistic, but they are trying to get a message across. Personally I would say that both guys are skilful and can in all probability fight pretty hard for real if they had to. I wish I was as fast.

As an aside, I did actually train for one of those Chi Sau competitions once although I did not end up competing. The training was good fun and much more realistic than a lot that goes on at WC school so it probably should be encouraged.

And on the triangle stance, that is a training stance, most chunners will have one foot forwards with either 50/50 weight distribution or a bit more on the back foot. Some a lot more on the back foot.

All the best

Berni

Oh my, just shut the **** up already. They are not giving it a go. Wing Chun is fucking retarded and encourages behaviour contrary to human self defense instincts , let alone martial arts that have actually been proven to work.

bobyclumsyninja
7/15/2011 4:38pm,
Some of those vids are really quite funny, but I would say that the guys and girl doing the Chi Sau competition stuff are at least putting themselves out there and having a go. Having a go at something athletic is admirable. That doesn't mean it's fighting, or very close to it. It's a very narrow application of certain techniques, that without the restrictions, play a small part only, in fighting ability.


As for the two Chunners doing the demos yes, it is pretty unrealistic, but they are trying to get a message across. Personally I would say that both guys are skilful and can in all probability fight pretty hard for real if they had to. I wish I was as fast. Being that fast is predicated on the assumption, that the guy will freeze with his arms out upon the first strike. Watch the videos again, but only watch the other guy...the one who get's taken out. Watch as the Sifu starts throwing, his arms go out, and he becomes pliable, and complacent. He's enabling poor technique to look effective.


As an aside, I did actually train for one of those Chi Sau competitions once although I did not end up competing. The training was good fun and much more realistic than a lot that goes on at WC school so it probably should be encouraged.It does look fun, and competing against others would inspire better training...but better for resistant push hands stuff...still not very martial, considering the full potential range of unarmed combat.

And on the triangle stance, that is a training stance, most chunners will have one foot forwards with either 50/50 weight distribution or a bit more on the back foot. Some a lot more on the back foot."train the way you fight, fight the way you train".