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View Full Version : How we can save Aikido: An honest opinion.



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Colin
4/10/2011 5:20am,
Until the threads have been merged - please post comments in this thread: http://www.bullshido.net/forums/showthread.php?t=105608

DCS
4/10/2011 7:00am,
What are my qualifications in Aikido?
I'm a 6th kyu ^_^
(Judo is 2 years after the Aikido finished)
My grappling experience mostly comes from that 2 year period.

OK. Thanks for the clarification.


In a website that prides itself on stringent requirements, it's pretty amazing how far such a conversation can go before such issues are raised :)
Resistance is futile, you will be investigated. :)


To try and target more accurately the core of your comment - what's special about me that should be teaching Ukemi? Nothing. Nothing at all.
Am I qualified to teach Ukemi? (possibly? what kind of qualification do you need?)
I expected more experience in a rough and tumble combat sport with lots of sweeps, throws and takedowns.


If it was so long ago when I did Aikido (and still pretty long since I used to to Judo, too) Why do I feel that I can teach Ukemi?
I'm not a psychologist and can't read minds across the globe. Why you feel qualified to teach ukemi for SD or MMA escapes me.


Well, I'm pretty damn good at ukemi.
Video or it didn't happen.


I have a free dive instructor who is teaching me oxygen depravation training. He cannot fight his way out of a paper bag.
Oxygen depravation? Sounds kinky to me. Link to video please (don't forget the NSFW tags). Thanks in advance. :P

RaiNnyX4
4/10/2011 9:30am,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AssByvGVx6s

Heh. I'm actually familiar with both of these guys. The Judo guy is national level for both Judo and BJJ. And the Aikido guy is just your run of the mill black belt with what looks like no real fighting experience.

DCS
4/10/2011 9:51am,
The aikido guy looks like the Michelin mascot.

judoka_uk
4/10/2011 10:01am,
Heh. I'm actually familiar with both of these guys. The Judo guy is national level for both Judo and BJJ. And the Aikido guy is just your run of the mill black belt with what looks like no real fighting experience.
Ahh, checked the vid description, he's that Staniezski chap who someone spams on the Judoforum whenever he does something.

What's the context of this? Challenge match, friendly spar?

Ignorami
4/10/2011 10:11am,
The foreground moved in slow motion, while the background appeared to run at normal speed.

Was that CGI, or was it due to the mass of the guy sucking in chronotons (or similar trekkie bullshit)?

gregaquaman
4/10/2011 11:05am,
OK. Thanks for the clarification.


Resistance is futile, you will be investigated. :)


I expected more experience in a rough and tumble combat sport with lots of sweeps, throws and takedowns.


I'm not a psychologist and can't read minds across the globe. Why you feel qualified to teach ukemi for SD or MMA escapes me.


Video or it didn't happen.


Oxygen depravation? Sounds kinky to me. Link to video please (don't forget the NSFW tags). Thanks in advance. :P

Cant find any video. Basicly it consists of riding a stationary bike while holding your breath.
the idea is I will be able function while I am out of breath for short periods of time. freedivers do it so that they don't die underwater.

My point is that as a MMAer I still look for anything that might enhance my game wether it is MMA related or not same as if I had the chance to learn some Akido break falling I would give it a crack because it might help.

I dont feel that I would need that person to have MMA experience that is my MMA coach's job.

Colin
4/10/2011 11:08am,
Aqua: I really appreciate your level-headed view of the subject. DCS is just busting my chops to see if he can get me to squirm anyway. It's because he loves me.

(In addition, what he's doing is called ad hominem. He's not trying to attack the argument, rather the guy who put the argument together. This is YMAS, after all.)

gregaquaman
4/10/2011 11:12am,
Read an Australian MMA mag one day. You would be amazed at how many freak kung fu/karate, how the hell did you become a fighter training like that guys there are out there that are doing well.

Colin
4/10/2011 11:14am,
Bob Jones and the BJC? ie: Australian Freestyle Karate otherwise known as Zen do Kai?
Yup. we got a shitton of guys like that.

I should start selling UKEMIDO black belts on ebay.

gregaquaman
4/10/2011 11:18am,
Hey just calm down now.
I am an official bob jones brown singlet in muay thai and it took me almost six months.
So it has to be credable.

Colin
4/10/2011 11:21am,
So it has to be credable.

It's definitely credable.

Just not sure how credible

In fact, it's probably the most credable Muay Thai rank ever issued, y'know MT not having any ranks outside the BJC and all ^^

BKR
4/10/2011 11:41am,
DCS: Now you're being obtuse.
It relates to Aikido because firstly, it was my pre-Judo ukemi experience, and furthermore, I believe Aikidoka generally have tons more breakfalling experience than Judoka of the same experience level, due to that fact that in compliant Aikido drilling, you get thrown down, alot. In Judo, you spend more time on your feet wrestling for position than time spent getting thrown.

It also relates to Aikido because it shows that a current Aikido training practice is demonstrably relevant to modern safety.

No, most judo training should (but may not) involve a lot more throwing than wrestling around. come to my judo class and you will get thrown a lot in various drills ranging from compliant to not so compliant.

How are you going to learn to throw unless you throw?

Anyway, I'll give you a 5 for the idea and a 6 so far for execution. Your lack of knowledge of ukemi shows badly, or you might rank higher.


Ben

BKR
4/10/2011 11:52am,
I was going to, but you made conclusions with anecdotes, i presented a scenario instead of addressing each point, however, if you want to consider an alternate angle, skills that are usable in life are those which become subconscious processes, take driving, as a learner, everything is an effort, with real experience, a lot of the processes are automated and the conscious mind is left having to only deal with an overview of the whole, this is how we become adept at things. We dont fully understand it, but thats the model. in terms of compliant ukemi, there is never a need for it to become a subconscious act, and for aikidoka, it's still something they engage in order to do.

[quote] Judoka, dont have that problem, because it happens at random times, forcing it to become a natural response. i suspect that model is also at the basis of alive training.

Incorrect. Most judo training involves a lot of throwing of compliant uke. Not someone jumping, but not resisting other than posture and body weight. This is especially true for beginners and other kyu grades.

In randori, less falling happens than in drilling, although their should be more ukemi taken in randori than one typically sees.

As one advances in training, how much to resist, when/how, if one is going to be thrown or take a fall, to fall or if to take ukemi becomes more and more a conscious act (speaking from my own experience). Sometimes it happens so fast and hard, no time to think, but even then there is awareness.

Ben

BKR
4/10/2011 12:02pm,
And BJJ destroys your ability to do anything other than flop onto your butt and then rub it up and down on a mat, like a dog with an itchy arse.

I present to you the finest BJJ practicioner of our age:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04BInFE8Eec

Impacted anal glands, very messy business!

Ben

BKR
4/10/2011 12:07pm,
What are my qualifications in Aikido?
I'm a 6th kyu ^_^
(Judo is 2 years after the Aikido finished)
My grappling experience mostly comes from that 2 year period.

In a website that prides itself on stringent requirements, it's pretty amazing how far such a conversation can go before such issues are raised :)

To try and target more accurately the core of your comment - what's special about me that should be teaching Ukemi? Nothing. Nothing at all.
Am I qualified to teach Ukemi? (possibly? what kind of qualification do you need?)

If it was so long ago when I did Aikido (and still pretty long since I used to to Judo, too) Why do I feel that I can teach Ukemi?

Well, I'm pretty damn good at ukemi.

LOL, I was going to read the rest and ask how much aikido and Judo you really have done.

Ben