BARTITSU - The original Bullshido?

[LLL]

http://www.budokwai.org/early_martial_arts.htm

Well I know it's basically jujutsu, so probably the techniques were OK, but just the name alone is so incredibly stupid....

[MrMcFu]

164 Posts in 3 days. That is truly amazing.

http://www.zanshin-dojo.de

[LLL]

Hey, only 24 posts... I don't know what that 'gold' means. You don't have to read them anyway ;)

[MrMcFu]

Oh sorry. I fucked that up. I don't know what Gold is either.

http://www.zanshin-dojo.de

[sinanju441]

Has anyone here actually participated in a Bartitsu seminar or studied the form in any manner?

[Wolf]

if you want information on Bartitsu go to http://www.bullshido.org/martialarts/Bartitsu.

[DdlR]

Has anyone here actually participated in a Bartitsu seminar or studied the form in any manner?

Yes. It's actually a very interesting study; they've revived the old jujitsu and stick fighting techniques recorded by E.W. Barton-Wright and his colleagues around 1900 as the basis, and are filling in the blanks with info. from books by Yukio Tani, Sadakazu Uyenishi, old-school boxing champions etc.

AFAIK most of the revival is out of historical interest but there are also plans to bring back Edwardian-style boxing vs. jujitsu and stick fighting competitions formats.

[sinanju441]

I have read that there are two types of Bartitsu being practiced. The first is the classic style, which is focused on a histrically accurate representation of the style as practiced in the 19th century. The second is Neo-Bartitsu, which is intended to represent an adaption of the form to modern times. I do not know as much about it as I would like, but my understanding is that it is based around concepts that are meant for "the street" rather than a formal competition.

[DdlR]

I have read that there are two types of Bartitsu being practiced. The first is the classic style, which is focused on a histrically accurate representation of the style as practiced in the 19th century. The second is Neo-Bartitsu, which is intended to represent an adaption of the form to modern times. I do not know as much about it as I would like, but my understanding is that it is based around concepts that are meant for "the street" rather than a formal competition.

http://www.bartitsu.org

In 2002, author and Bartitsu enthusiast Will Thomas set up an email list to communicate with others of like mind. This correspondence developed into an international association known as the Bartitsu Society, which was formed to research E.W. Barton-Wright's "New Art of Self Defence". Although initially focussed on academic and historical documentation, the charter of the Bartitsu Society grew to encompass reviving the art at the practical level.

The first task was to gather as much primary source information as possible about Barton-Wright and his martial art, and towards this goal, members of the Society scoured institutions such as the British Library as well as old bookstores and newspaper archives. Eventually, the Society had enough information to be able to confidently define “Canonical Bartitsu”; the collection of self defence sequences, kata and techniques that were specifically presented as Bartitsu by Barton-Wright and his associates between 1899 and 1903. Canonical Bartitsu is maintained as a mark of respect for Barton-Wright’s vision, as a matter of historical preservation and also as a form of common language amongst contemporary enthusiasts.

Having established the Bartitsu canon, the Society then turned its attention to the idea of neo-Bartitsu. This was suggested as a way for Bartitsu enthusiasts, both individuals and groups, to work creatively with the canonical material. Neo-Bartitsu was also conceived as a way to extend the art through reference to the corpus of boxing, jiujitsu, savate and stick-fighting methods recorded in the books produced by Barton-Wright’s colleagues and their students between 1903 and the early 1920s. In this sense, neo-Bartitsu can be described as “Bartitsu as it might have been” or as “Bartitsu as it can be today.”

By 2004, members of the Society had begun offering practical workshops in both canonical and neo-Bartitsu techniques.

[cyrijl]

This all sounds very cult like. If they manage to find any practitioners still alive or more supporting documents then it might turn out to be interesting. Right now it is hard to say.

[sinanju441]

I presume people are enamored of it due to its connection to Sherlock Holmes. I have heard there is an article in the latest issue of GUNS AND AMMO about the firearms Holmes used in the stories of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, so your cult analogy might not be far off.
In the Jeremy Brett series that was on PBS, Holmes does make use of old-school bare knuckle boxing to dust of a "rapscillion" in a pub.

[DdlR]

No-one has practiced Bartitsu per se since about 1904, but there are some jujitsu clubs in the UK that trace their lineage back to the schools set up by Tani, Uyenishi and their students. Tani himself was the chief instructor at the London Budokwai for many years (the Budokwai is the oldest martial arts school in Europe, active since 1918, but they've been teaching primarily Kodokan judo since 1920).

Edited to add: there are other "survivals", more-or-less directly based on Bartitsu; aspects of the stick fighting syllabus were passed down through various associations, etc., but as a complete method combining pre-WW1 jujitsu, boxing, savate and walking stick defense, Bartitsu only really existed for the couple of years that the original Bartitsu Club was active in London.

The Bartitsu Society has been collating source documents for the past six years and has published a number of articles and one good book on the subject. I believe that some of the senior guys are prepping an article for the Journal of Asian Martial Arts.

[DdlR]

I presume people are enamored of it due to its connection to Sherlock Holmes. I have heard there is an article in the latest issue of GUNS AND AMMO about the firearms Holmes used in the stories of Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, so your cult analogy might not be far off.
In the Jeremy Brett series that was on PBS, Holmes does make use of old-school bare knuckle boxing to dust of a "rapscillion" in a pub.

The Bartitsu Society is a group of martial artists and history enthusiasts who are interested in what Barton-Wright was doing around the turn of the 20th century. I suppose that any hobby or interest shared by a group (Sherlock Holmes fandom, etc.) could be described as being cult-like, but it seems like a stretch.

[Dirty Rooster]

...do I put my picture up again? Do I?

[sinanju441]

I actually meant "cult" as in "cult following," like Star Wars fans who actually practice light saber techniques (such people really do exist). I do appreciate the fine information I receiving at this site, however.
I am wondering if Bartitsu is actually considered Bullshido by people at this site. I ask only because I wouldn't mind trying a few of the seminars related to it. I do not consider proponents of an art to be impartial, but that is stating the obvious.

[cyrijl]

Well if there goal is to recreate the art as the guy was working on it...then there ya go. If they are trying to come up with the most effective martial art...they are a little behind the times.