Need some feedback on first gun for a friend.

**Lord Skeletor** · Posted On: 9/08/2010 7:52pm

The only HK guns that I absolutely love are my MP5, my P7M13/M8, and my USP Tactical. Yeah...I've got a G36, but it's a heavy bitch and just not practical as far as I'm concerned.

**Wounded Ronin** · Posted On: 9/09/2010 9:49pm

Originally Posted by Phrost

Have him read this too, before he throws money away on an HK.

http://larrycorreia.wordpress.com/20...d-we-hate-you/

Just read it.

Honestly, if I had to get into a gunfight with a subgun, then I would rather have my PPsH.

BUURRN.

Still, though, far be it from me to portray myself as knowing anything about guns or tactics, but it always seemed to me not to make sense why everyone nowadays always wants to own or talk about expensive, accurate, brand-named firearms, but nobody gets really excited over super-reliable World War II weapons. Most firefights take place at close range, so shouldn't reliability, and large bores, be king?

In the Vietnam War memoir, "Gone Native", which I recommend to everyone, the author describes one moment on a LRRP where, when the squad leader had called for a "mad minute", all the AR style rifles in the squads failed to chamber rounds properly and therefore couldn't fire in full auto, probably due to dew forming in the magazines after having been out in the jungle overnight. But someone had brought along a M3A1 and that worked perfectly.

**Phrost** · Posted On: 9/09/2010 10:14pm

I'm just waiting for someone to refresh/modernize the Thompson.

**Wounded Ronin** · Posted On: 9/10/2010 9:10am

Here's the link to the book: Amazon.com: Gone Native: An NCO's Story (9780804116374): Alan Cornett: Books

Again, I recommend it.

**chemistry** · Posted On: 9/10/2010 10:30am

Just as with martial arts, it's best to learn the basics first, so that you can establish a good set of mechanics. It's much easier to build up (and quicker) from a good set of basics than to have to tear someone's bad habits down.

He doesn't even have to start with a rifle just yet. For 250, he could easily get a Ruger 22/45 pistol, along with several 550 pack bricks of .22 LR ammo, and learn how to establish good trigger control, while not picking up bad habits, such as flinching, jerking, etc.

Once he's established some good mechanics, then he could start with a centerfire rifle. Whether he chooses to use a .308 Winchester chambered rifle is more up to him. I'd also go with the suggestion above, of getting an AR-15 type rifle for about 700 bucks (DPMS ones can be found cheaply these days), and a lot of ammo.

Once he gets used to this, he can now start shooting the heavier calibers, without the fear of learning bad habits from the start.

**Mr. Machette** · Posted On: 9/10/2010 12:55pm

Originally Posted by Phrost

I'm just waiting for someone to refresh/modernize the Thompson.

Wait no longer! Your .45acp subgun is already here!

http://www.kriss-tdi.com/

.45acp at 1500rpm? FUGGEDDABOUDIT!!!

YouTube - KRISS .45 cal SMG

***WhiteShark*** · Posted On: 9/10/2010 1:07pm

Well I'm sure I can just go to Wallymart and get one of those.

**Mr. Machette** · Posted On: 9/10/2010 1:28pm

Originally Posted by WhiteShark

Well I'm sure I can just go to Wallymart and get one of those.

I'm not even sure these are available for police and military yet.

I have a feeling there will eventually be a semi auto version for civilians at some point. Or at the very least that the same recoil system will appear in other weapons soon. I wouldn't mind a 7.62x39 carbine of some sort compensated that way. Imagine Krink sized weapon that doesn't jump around when rapid fired. Sweet ass!

**Robstafarian** · Posted On: 9/10/2010 3:00pm

Originally Posted by Mr. Machette

I have a feeling there will eventually be a semi auto version for civilians at some point.

They did a "first come, first served" limited sale something like a year ago; I think I remember the price was somewhere between $1,500 and $2,000. Personally, I don't find the recoil of .45ACP (out of a full size 1911) to be bad enough to warrant the extra expenditure. If I had the money to spare, I'd rather spend it on range time, ammo, and a few classes.