I am sorry I wasn't clear; I was asking you to elaborate on the text I've emphasized in the quote below:
Originally Posted by Lord Skeletor
Originally Posted by Lord Skeletor
Originally Posted by Robstafarian
LOL No problem, bro. The 1911 design has been around for about 100 years now...and while it was a good choice, given its contemporary competition at the time (except for maybe German weaponry); it has far exceeded its lifespan.
For too long, companies out there have fought tooth and nail to keep the platform alive by simply trying to "reinvent the wheel", by upgrading parts, strengthening the steel, hardening its metal parts, putting different sorts of buffers or plastics into the guide rod assembly/bushing area, taking up slack in the single action trigger, tightening up the tolerances between frame and slide, trying to upgrade its horrible sights---and you want to know why? Because for some unknown reason---people like the single action trigger pull. 99.9% of the people who like the design...like it because they feel that it shoots accurately and that it's slimline design fits their hands.
Let me be clear on something. If you shoot a large caliber hole (45ACP) in something...and follow it up with another large caliber hole that touches the previous shot; people think that they have found something special. Forgetting that the large caliber hole provides more room for error in the overall scheme of things. You will see less and less of this, when the bullet that you are shooting gets smaller.
If you are one of the types who likes the "single action" trigger pull so much, go ahead and cock a single action revolver, double/single action revolver, a single action revolver, and DA/SA handgun, and you will SEE THE EXACT SAME RESULTS. The only difference being the initial, DA trigger pull....which you can easily master, if you actually practice with the thing.
The 45ACP bullet's cartridge is round-nosed and not conducive to proper feeding. The stock version of the pistol is around $350.00 and it is a malfunction machine, no matter who produces the thing, with failures to feed and failure to extract being its chief problems. Sure...you can spend $900-$3,000. to get an overworked, custom masterpiece of a gun which will still malfunction in the same manner that I have described---albeit not as much.
The bottom line is that there are dozens of more safe and reliable handgun platforms out there to choose from than this antiquated gun. Sure...some people swear by them. I don't. Over the past 30 years, I've seen too many fail--whether they be GI Classic Springfields or $2600. Les Baer Specials---and they all fail in the same areas. Their failure numbers and types would literally instantly discontinue a modern counterpart (like a Glock or SiG conventional design, like the G17 or the SIG 226) if a major manufacturer tried to push them. However...nobody is going to badmouth the venerable, American classic---they just try to reinvent it every 5-10 years....with the same, damned results.
They say that insanity is repeating the same behavior or doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. This is a perfect example. You want to collect them? Sure...go ahead. You like shooting them? Sure...have fun. Want to carry one for self defense? **** that. I'll trust a design that I have faith in....HK, Sig, Glock....you get the picture. I'm not trusting my life to a roll of the dice, brother; and neither should you.
I've been practicing the hell out of this and feel pretty comfortable placing the first shot where I need it to go. Unfortunately, now I sometimes fingerfuck the SA that comes directly after because I'm expecting more tension. I just can't win.
Originally Posted by Lord Skeletor
Originally Posted by Money
Money, my brotha...all it takes is time and practice. It's sort of like driving a stick-shift...once you find the sweet spot on the clutch and coordinate it with the shifting...you're golden. Firearms skills (like most other fine motor skills) seriously degrade with the passage of time if you're not practicing. I dry fire something 3-4 times a week without fail. Practice and learn the art of trigger indexing---and you'll see immediate results!
Again...that rant up there about the 1911s---it's just that. It's a rant based upon nothing more than my experience as an armorer, rangemaster, and being somebody who people always bring their broken/malfunctioning **** to. Everyone's entitled to their opinion---mine's just that you can do better with $900.-$2000. than pissing it away on a 1911-design.
Skeletor, you make a great argument for parking the 1911. It has always been my favorite coming from revolvers its just a good feel and large caliber the malfunctions were just sort of accepted trade off for semi-autos years ago. I never even cared about the sites because I favor instinctive shooting over iron sites on pistols (anything over 25ft needs a rifle is my m.o.).
When I was first handed a Glock 25+ years ago it just felt like junk and fired like mush and an over penetrating low stopping power bullet to add insult. I just had the mindset of an old man when it came to embracing logic in this department. I came to Camp Skeletor with enough examples of failure to know its time for this old dog to learn new tricks. I not only saw how much rust accumulated in my body but also how dated my tactics and methods are. I am really glad I attended, thanks for renwing my intrest and bringing me into the 21st century.
I appreciate the kind words. Training--much like anything else out there---fighting, shooting, baking cakes; it's all being carefully scrutinized and re-worked from the ground level on a near-constant basis. If you learned CQB or shooting skills in the military 10 years ago---you'll see a world of difference after lots of the military vets are returning from overseas service with first-hand experience on what's working---as well as what isn't. You can probably back me up on it...but back in the day, only specialized units and special teams practiced CQB, building search techniques, and hostage rescue. Now--your standard infantryman is being trained due to the fucktons of house-to-house searching going on over there....those techniques they are learning are the results of "best practices" in trying to save their hides in doing their "day to day" jobs.
Originally Posted by chainpunch
Back when I went through basic and advanced SWAT schools back in the late-90's and turn of the century, we went to the LAPD guys and Blackwater---simply because LAPD was serving a metric fuckton of high-risk warrants and they were "the authority" along with the cadre at Blackwater which was made up of SEAL and SF dudes. So, all-in-all; at the time...we were getting the best of what was out there. But even so...10 years later; comparing that to what is being taught now, there are serious, noticeable differences in both philosophies and basic tactics that make you sit back and say, "Damn, man....that **** we used to do was crazy; I can't believe we used to do dumb **** like that."
However...this is why it's important to stay connected and keep training yourself. Just like martial arts...you have to keep training to stay on top of your game and ensure that your opponent (or bad guy) has the worst day possible.
I definitely see 1911s fail a lot in competitions, but they tend to be the fancy "open" category ones, which I surmise have tighter tolerances for better accuracy. The more normal ones seem better. Last time I competed, using my Kimber TLE 2 that I had gotten used, I had one type 2 malfunction with around 170 rounds fired. That isn't so bad is it?
Originally Posted by Lord Skeletor
It's kind of funny that you mention this. I went out to train/play with the "serious" airsoft team I mentioned earlier and they were doing room clearing exercises and the like. The guy that seemed to be the main "tactics' guy definitely knew his way around a weapon but some of the stuff they were doing felt like it was a little "last generation".
For example they were doing the bump instead of squeezing (from front to back near as I could tell), when moving down a hallway they had one person covering the rear that i would theoretically assume was already clear. There was a lot of time spent in the "fatal funnel" of hallways" while the entry team cleared, and people got right up on the corners instead of pieing them. Those were the main things I noticed that I felt was done better at camp skeletor.
Eventually I'll probably suggest some of the stuff we were doing as alternative methods but I want to make a strong impression before I start stepping on toes.
Getting past the slight differences it was nice to have a refresher course. The guy sponsoring the team was there and took note that I was the only one doing strong side/weak side transitions around corners.
When we went force on force I got shot twice, once because I was right up on a corner shooting weak side and my right hand got shot. The next was because fatigue was getting to me as I was shooting around a corner that I should have been shooting weakside so I transitioned to strong side and had to expose more of my body and thus I got shot. (though i think I would have gotten him first if my first few shots BB wasn't deflected by some netting that was in the way of my barrel)
Last edited by Anna Kovacs; 8/30/2010 11:02pm at .
That would depend if the malfunction was during "a game" like IDPA, where you lost a round or match---or during a self defense situation where somebody lost their life.
Originally Posted by Wounded Ronin
You want to shoot a .45? Roll with a Sig 220 or a USP .45. You won't be dissatisfied.
Agreed. Again...there's only so much we can impart in a short period of time. There are literally about a dozen or so "agreed upon" ways to take down hallways or enter rooms. We showed you guys one or two ways.
Originally Posted by AnnaTrocity
We had a slide on "Hick's Law" during one of the power points which basically stated that you should pick one or two techniques and roll with them. Because under stress, your mind will literally think about everything you've "got in the toolbox" and you lose reaction time as a result, more often than not.
If possible, I prefer limited penetration when possible to help minimize my unknown danger areas. If I know that 85% of the room is clean because we have two guns in the room, I know *exactly* where I'm going when I get the squeeze. We did try to emphasize the weak-hand shooting a lot, simply because in order to minimize exposure in hallways and doorways, you have to naturally swap shooting hands---otherwise, you're going to end up putting your elbow and leg out unnecessarily.
We often harped on people with rifles "chicken winging" it, because it gave your enemy that much more to shoot at. The big thing to remember is to SLOOOOOOOW DOWN! We probably preached that more than anything else. Most people, when you put a gun in their hands and bad guys in the vicinity will tend to speed up (often to the point of jogging) and will overlook important details that could get them injured or killed. Attention to detail combined with not moving faster than you can react to shoot were big teaching points with us...as I'm sure that you guys remember.
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