Thread: I found teh real push hands
7/26/2010 9:37pm, #11
So what is the ruleset and scoring system videos 1 & 3 are competing under? Is there one unified approach to push hands competitions?
7/26/2010 11:41pm, #12
7/27/2010 1:29am, #13
#1 almost certainly doesn't allow any contact to the head, back of the neck, direct grabs of the leg, or likely even both hands on the back at the same time for long. #3 likely allows all those things.
Scores are generally something on the order of: 1 point (or 2) for making one's opponent hit the floor with anything other than their feet, less if you fall down to do it too. It mght be first to 3, or first to 5, or most points within some period of time as well.
7/27/2010 9:48pm, #14
- Join Date
- Feb 2007
- Chen style taiji
I actually thought that the guy in the black uniform with the red sash at the end of the first vid was best. He was relaxed and rooted and his pushes were controlled and relatively precise. The rest of the stuff just looked like sloppy standup (and falldown) grappling.
I think that push hands should be different from grappling. For instance, in "Mastering Jujitsu," Renzo writes: "Rather than confront strength with strength, jujitsu confronts strength with efficient technique and strategy so that the weaker fighter can attain victory. In practice, this means applying a high percentage of your total strength to a low percentage of your opponent's strength."
So in grappling (as in all types of sparring), whether in CMA or BJJ,we are trying to locate the opponent's weakness and apply a large percentage of our body's force to it to defeat him (or her). But in push hands (not shuai jiao), I've always felt that we're probing the partner's structure to help him (or her) build better root and posture, and the ability to neutralize and redirect incoming force. The focus is really on cooperation not competition. Kauz writes in his book "Push Hands": "I believe we err in attempting to make tai chi more sportive. Tai chi offers us an opportunity to relax, to open up, to ground and center ourselves...Students who are attracted to competitive push hands will develop some level of skill in avoiding and resisting pushes, and in pushing, but they will fail woefully in achieving the much more important and valuable changes in themselves push hands could make possible...Push hands done according to tai chi principles is alien to us, to the way we conduct ourselves in daily life. That is, invariably if we are pushed we resist. If our own attempt to push meets resistance, we push harder."
So at this point in my life I've concluded that students make more progress in tai chi when push hands is viewed as a noncompetitive, but "alive," drill. Grappling and sparring are also necessary, but they are different tools for progress, with different aims, that should be viewed differently. As for tournaments like the ones shown above, maybe they should be called "T'ai Chi Grappling" as opposed to "Push Hands."
7/27/2010 11:35pm, #15
7/28/2010 7:19pm, #16
- Join Date
- Jun 2008
- Toronto, Canada
- Judo & BJJ hacker
7/28/2010 8:07pm, #17