Power punchers with no control

**TenTigers** · Posted On: 10/22/2011 9:53pm

an alligator's jaws bite with roughly 2125 lbs psi.
A mother alligator carries its young in its jaws.
An alligator has the brain roughly the size of a plum.
When a person says they don't realize how hard they are hitting, what are they really saying?

If they did not have physical control every time they put a fork into their mouth to eat, they would ram it through their throat.
If they tried to brush an eyelash from their eye, they would gouge their eye out.

The truth of the matter is, it's not that they lack physical control, but mental emotional control. They are making a conscious decision to hit hard.

These people really don't belong in a school training with others.

I think you are looking at the problem wrong.

**MMAMickey** · Posted On: 10/23/2011 4:37am

Originally Posted by TenTigers

an alligator's jaws bite with roughly 2125 lbs psi.
A mother alligator carries its young in its jaws.
An alligator has the brain roughly the size of a plum.
When a person says they don't realize how hard they are hitting, what are they really saying?

If they did not have physical control every time they put a fork into their mouth to eat, they would ram it through their throat.
If they tried to brush an eyelash from their eye, they would gouge their eye out.

The truth of the matter is, it's not that they lack physical control, but mental emotional control. They are making a conscious decision to hit hard.

These people really don't belong in a school training with others.

I think you are looking at the problem wrong.

You're wrong.

Throwing punches with correct technique and speed under pressure can often result in them landing substantially harder than intended in a sparring environment. There are obviously dicks who just hit hard regardless (probably including the subject of the OP here), but to suggest that it cannot be anything other than deliberate is fallacious to say in the least.

..and those fail analogies were fail.

**TenTigers** · Posted On: 10/23/2011 9:32am

sure, it happens, but if it is happening more often than not, then there is a problem.
BTW-it may not be a totally conscious act. Some people are blinded by their own egos.
-Just as you were obviously blinded by the awesomeness of my analogies. ;-)

**MMAMickey** · Posted On: 10/23/2011 9:53am

The reason I take issue with your analogies is that they fail to consider the mechanical generation of force which leads to a hard punch. It's true that if they tried to lift a fork to their mouth with the same force they'd do themselves injury, but the mechanical processes involved mean that logically no analogy could be successfully drawn between the two.

**Neo Sigma** · Posted On: 10/23/2011 8:27pm

Since this thread seems to have risen from the grave, I should probably point out that I've solved this problem by leaving that gym and finding competent instruction, which I wasn't getting. Funny how learning how to defend properly helps the issue!

**dwkfym** · Posted On: 10/24/2011 1:50pm

I agree with Mick. Guys with very good mechanics will hit hard, thats why we sorta "pull" punches. okay, not "we" because I'm probably not one of those guys. For instance, when I spar light, my kicks are aimed about an inch or so off of the target surface. It still hurts, but doesn't damage. In a fight or harder sparring, I'm aiming almost 10 inches past the surface. Samne thing with punches. My punches are thrown with good mechanics, but I aim away from the actual target area. Of course, when your opponent moves into your punch nothing much you can do to help.

Adjusting the speed only helps so much (you guys probably seen those slow hooks that actually damage a lot)

**Permalost** · Posted On: 10/24/2011 2:28pm

I think part of it is a matter of a new person trying to keep up. If they're moving as fast as they can to keep up with the other person, they'll likely be hitting harder than they imagine. There's a million things to focus on in sparring, and a person may lose track of how hard they're hitting. It's not as simple as someone eating with a fork. That's not to say that it's cool to hit too hard or that someone shouldn't be corrected, but I wouldn't tell someone that they're either stupid or an asshole because they're new and hitting hard AND they can operate a fork. A more apt analogy would be using that same fork in a competitive eating contest with a time limit. I'll bet some throats get stabbed in those.

**atheistmantis** · Posted On: 10/31/2011 5:47pm

I agree. However in my past martial arts training I have run accross some assholes who after numerous warnings refused to exercise control. They were breaking ribs and knocking out the younger smaller students. We decided to take control and teach them a lesson. After that, everything was fine.

**Mark-E-Mark** · Posted On: 12/22/2011 4:47pm

Originally Posted by Rene "Zendokan" Gysenbergs

Most important advice is already given:

One of the things that I learned from Savate and most other Kickboxing styles don't have (or don't practise) is kicking and boxing when backing-away. (no "created by the French jokes" please).

It works wonderwell in confusing your opponent, but it's more difficult than it looks.

Instead of backing-away and than moving-in for the kicking or boxing, the backing-away and then kicking/boxing have to be timed as one movement, it takes some training to get the timing right and than some practise to throw combo's while backing-out.

But once you get it, it's fun to give your opponent a false sense of victory by letting him gain territorium while he's eating a first set of hard roundhouse kicks, than see his expression change when he comes to the conclusion that he has been set-up and back-away while you come in with hard kicks.
Afterwards he will always hesitated when sparring with you, since gaining territorium =/= winning.

Interesting. Might have to try it.

I think TaeKwonDo fighters use a similar maneuver.

**gregaquaman** · Posted On: 12/23/2011 1:38am

Originally Posted by Neo Sigma

Since this thread seems to have risen from the grave, I should probably point out that I've solved this problem by leaving that gym and finding competent instruction, which I wasn't getting. Funny how learning how to defend properly helps the issue!

That.

There is a difference between somone punching you as hard as they can to help you and punching you as hard as they can to hurt you.

Don't know if it has anything to do with alligators though