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  1. Mor Sao is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/14/2010 8:03am

    supporting member
     Style: Jook Lum South Mantis,

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The best advice to anyone seeking to harden their hands in the old ways is to have personal instruction with a teacher who can be there if and when you any issues.

    Slow and steady wins the race, and you do not want to damage the joints of the hands. I know masters in Okinawa and Japan who have issues from being over-exuberant with hand conditioning when they were younger.

    I started in Uechi Ryu Karate when I was younger and trained it for 8 years before moving on to the Chinese systems. I was taught how to condition the hands in a rather slow and very methodical approach. tapping the makiwara and other bean bags were part of the training.

    We also used dit da jow before and after training.

    Also be aware that some anatomical weapons are not designed for certain attacks.

    I would never punch anyone in the head with my fist, but would rather use a hammer fist or a palm of some sort which had much more tissue to cushion the blows.

    Unless you can punch through serious amounts of concrete blocks and not blink or break your hands, use your head and do not punch people in the head with your knuckles. punching someone in the face is one thing. punching them in the head is something totally different. I have seen many people drive their metacarpal bones up their wrists/forearms from thinking they could punch people in the head.







  2. iopyud is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/14/2010 8:51am


     Style: MT/Ex-Judo NO SPRAWL?!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Great. Thanks for the replies. I actually am seeking to minimize injuries and potential injuries during training so, I'm gathering info.
  3. maofas is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/14/2010 9:57am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kenkojuku Karate, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by shorinjite View Post
    the one thing that a makiwara does well is it allows the practitioner to actually see their impact. Because it does not give, stopping the movement on impact of the flat surface means you can see how your form is (correct/incorrect).
    This is incorrect. A properly built makiwara DOES have give, even if it's literally just a 2x4 cemented into the ground, it's shaved at such an angle to let it bend and flex with each strike. Other versions have slots cut into the striking surfaces to give it play. If someone is making you hit something with no give, stop that **** immediately, you're destroying your joints.
  4. Mor Sao is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/14/2010 11:46am

    supporting member
     Style: Jook Lum South Mantis,

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    you always want it to move, immovable objects struck with power will lead to problems over time.







  5. HereBeADragon is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/14/2010 11:52am


     Style: Limalama, Judo & BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Dale Dugas View Post
    you always want it to move, immovable objects struck with power will lead to problems over time.
    Ah physics my old nemesis we meet again.
  6. shorinjite is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/14/2010 12:06pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: shorinji

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    when I said it didn't give, I meant that unlike a bag it will not conform around your hand so you actually see how the impact was made if the strike is stopped on contact. I by no means ment "no give" like a block wall....sorry for any confusion. I personally have been useing makiwara for a few decades and have seen no ill effects, but as others have stated I was taught to progress very slowly and follow the simple rule of "if it hurts stop, your only hurting yourself and not learning anything but pain"
  7. SonofSpiridonov is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/14/2010 12:11pm


     Style: Hybrid Martial Arts

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well personally id rather have strong hips, than strong knuckles. Knockout power über alles.
  8. HereBeADragon is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/14/2010 3:53pm


     Style: Limalama, Judo & BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by SonofSpiridonov View Post
    Well personally id rather have strong hips, than strong knuckles. Knockout power über alles.
    I'm happy to have both ;)
  9. maofas is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/14/2010 5:37pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kenkojuku Karate, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by shorinjite View Post
    when I said it didn't give, I meant that unlike a bag it will not conform around your hand so you actually see how the impact was made if the strike is stopped on contact. I by no means ment "no give" like a block wall....sorry for any confusion. I personally have been useing makiwara for a few decades and have seen no ill effects, but as others have stated I was taught to progress very slowly and follow the simple rule of "if it hurts stop, your only hurting yourself and not learning anything but pain"
    Ahhh, I got you, sorry and good to hear. I've seen some horrible makeshift makiwaras in "traditional" krotty dojos where I had to bite my tongue watching the instructor make kids ruin their joints on them.

    As far as being taught to progress slowly, you received better instruction than me in that regard. I was told by a friend of my head instructor (who was a very good karateka and very tough) to smash it as hard as I could till my knuckles broke and grew back stronger. I don't know about the stronger part, but I had some nasty knuckle problems that lingered for at least 2 years...

    Nowadays I just do weight-bearing exercises on hard surfaces. I have Judo to ruin my hands instead (man my left hand's fingers are fucked!).
    Last edited by maofas; 7/14/2010 5:42pm at .
  10. Dsimon3387 is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/14/2010 9:23pm

    Join us... or die
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by maofas View Post
    Ahhh, I got you, sorry and good to hear. I've seen some horrible makeshift makiwaras in "traditional" krotty dojos where I had to bite my tongue watching the instructor make kids ruin their joints on them.

    As far as being taught to progress slowly, you received better instruction than me in that regard. I was told by a friend of my head instructor (who was a very good karateka and very tough) to smash it as hard as I could till my knuckles broke and grew back stronger. I don't know about the stronger part, but I had some nasty knuckle problems that lingered for at least 2 years...

    Nowadays I just do weight-bearing exercises on hard surfaces. I have Judo to ruin my hands instead (man my left hand's fingers are fucked!).
    what got us was breaking fingers on sparring... well dislocations actually. Evrything from grabbing a gi too hard, to an openhand with a finger getting caught going the opposite direction.

    Karate training can be rough on the hands no doubt.
    This thread never was a high quality conversation - My friend vern Gilbert on the William Acquier thread.

    The fight in question having started over who owns which piece of rubble. Nicko1;2233174 On the Acquier Kim Fiasco slash thread.
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