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  1. markjudo is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Findlay, Ohio
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    149

    Posted On:
    6/22/2010 6:28pm


     Style: JUDO

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    There should something in the Data Base. I will have to call Headquarter and find out.
    Mr. Kliz belong to Club: TX0900
    I will have to find the name of that Club
      #51
  2. Matt Phillips is offline
    Matt Phillips's Avatar

    NOTE TO SELF - MOAR GRAPPLE - GET A NORMAL HAIR CUT - REPEAT

    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Bahstun
    Posts
    9,756

    Posted On:
    6/22/2010 7:19pm

    supporting member
     Style: Submission Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mtripp View Post
    Matt,

    If you are going to tell them that then you REALLY should tell them how much I did NOT want to get involved and how hard I looked for ANY other possible answer, save the one I got....

    ...oh, if this keeps up I am sending Bullshido my Vodka bill....
    Mark bent over backwards to find any plausible out for Chuck. As he says, he really did not want to do this. It was painful to do, for Mark, for me (Chuck was my close friend), really for everyone involved. BUT HE DID IT.

    We spent hours on the phone going over this stuff. We took turns running through every possible scenario, but the sad truth is that it was clear Chuck was lying by the end of the very first conversation we had.

    Mark is a true professional, and a unique asset to the site. And he has to stay.

    Respect the Tripp.

    P.S. WHen the dust settles we are going to have to take a good look at what JudoSensei did and why.
    Now darkness comes; you don't know if the whales are coming. - Royce Gracie


    KosherKickboxer has t3h r34l chi sao

    In De Janerio, in blackest night,
    Luta Livre flees the fight,
    Behold Maeda's sacred tights;
    Beware my power... Blue Lantern's light!
      #52
  3. catfishaggie is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Dallas, Tx
    Posts
    700

    Posted On:
    6/22/2010 8:12pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Just out of curiosity was the database searched for a "Chuck Hardin" or "Charles Christopher Hardin". The reason why I ask is that I go by Chad but when signing up for orgs or official business I use my full name.

    IB4 the qq. I just want it clarified so that someone can't claim **** on either side of the fence, that's all.

    PS. Mark if you ever come down to Dallas I'll be glad to by you all the shots you want just to hear some of those old judo stories.
      #53
  4. markjudo is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Findlay, Ohio
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    149

    Posted On:
    6/22/2010 8:24pm


     Style: JUDO

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Did chuck Hardin say he won/fought in a State or National Judo Event? This is much easlier to track than a local event
      #54
  5. markjudo is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Findlay, Ohio
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    149

    Posted On:
    6/22/2010 8:27pm


     Style: JUDO

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I looked up everyone that had the last name "HARDIN" in the data base. No Chuck, No Charles
      #55
  6. Whacker is offline
    Whacker's Avatar

    Pulling mount since '09

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    NC
    Posts
    1,295

    Posted On:
    6/22/2010 8:37pm


     Style: jits da variedade brasile

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What the hell. I don't know why some of those posts were culled, quite a few of them are on topic. Coach, we need to show you how to properly quote so your posts are easier to read.

    First off, let me state that it's entirely possible I don't know all the relevant facts, though I have tried to keep up with this. So, perhaps some education for me is in order. Please tell me if any of these are incorrect.

    1. Chuck has claimed that he participated in several shiai's based on this post here: I Challenge Chuck Hardin AKA Cy Q Faunce - Page 67 - No BS MMA and Martial Arts . I haven't read anything where he states those were USJA sanctioned events, if I'm wrong please point me to where he posted that.

    2. Have you found, through your USJA knowledge and contacts, evidence of USJA sanctioned events being held during those years ?83-85? at the air force base in question?

    3. Has anyone been able to contact Chuck's former coach to verify these events, if he was hosting them under the perview of USJA, or were these simply "local events"?

    My skepticism hinges on a number of issues. First, it is a fact that one does NOT need to be a member of any Judo organization to host an event. This is a plain, simple, hard, logical fact. Whether or not other clubs as members of national organizations are willing to participate is another issue, but it is a fact that these events could have taken place. Another possibility is that there are or were other Judo clubs with owners affiliated with national organizations that can and did participate in these events, whether or not they were sanctioned or even insured. Further, it is a fact that Chuck's old coach could have either been misleading people into thinking they were USJA events, or perhaps unwittingly believing they were USJA sanctioned and were not and that he felt he was following proper form. Additionally, what I do know about insurance indicates that one does NOT need to be a member of any national martial art organization to obtain coverage for gyms or events, so it is entirely possible that these events were covered properly. Lastly, with all due respect to your experience, knowledge, and history, you cannot assign probabilities to any of the above, because you were not there and you do not have firsthand knowledge of these events.

    Again, maybe there is more that I am missing or missed in my reading. If someone can definitively show me the posts WITH links that are damning AND the posts where said claims are refuted WITH links, then I am 100% open to any corrections and any conclusion coming of this. But for now, I haven't seen anything that is 100% damning.
    Last edited by Whacker; 6/22/2010 8:45pm at .
      #56
  7. catfishaggie is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Dallas, Tx
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    700

    Posted On:
    6/22/2010 8:38pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by markjudo View Post
    I looked up everyone that had the last name "HARDIN" in the data base. No Chuck, No Charles
    Thank you very much and appreciate the answer and settles it for me.
      #57
  8. Hiro Protagonist is offline
    Hiro Protagonist's Avatar

    Has entered Barovia...

    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Posts
    5,436

    Posted On:
    6/22/2010 8:51pm

    supporting member
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ...But surely Cy could provide something else than just the documentation?

    - Photos.

    - An old gi.

    - The belt he wore.

    - The name of some friend he trained with who could provide something of the above.
      #58
  9. Whacker is offline
    Whacker's Avatar

    Pulling mount since '09

    Join Date
    Mar 2009
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    NC
    Posts
    1,295

    Posted On:
    6/22/2010 8:55pm


     Style: jits da variedade brasile

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    How about we just find his coach and get the story straight from the horses mouth. Everything else, USJA formal records aside, is simply speculation on everyone's part.
      #59
  10. Mtripp is offline
    Mtripp's Avatar

    Choked out by Gene Lebell

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Grand Blanc, MI
    Posts
    3,277

    Posted On:
    6/22/2010 8:57pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    <<<What the hell. I don't know why some of those posts were culled, quite a few of them are on topic. Coach, we need to show you how to properly quote so your posts are easier to read.>>>

    Seems to me that this << >>> means YOU and lacking that means me.

    <<<1. Chuck has claimed that he participated in several shiai's based on this post here: I Challenge Chuck Hardin AKA Cy Q Faunce - Page 67 - No BS MMA and Martial Arts . I haven't read anything where he states those were USJA sanctioned events, if I'm wrong please point me to where he posted that.>>>

    Please reread what Mark Hunter posted.

    <<<2. Have you found, through your USJA knowledge and contacts, evidence of USJA sanctioned events being held during those years ?83-85? at the air force base in question?>>>

    Of course the State of Texas held dozens of Judo Shiai during those years. USJI and USJA held many events. Again, please reread Mark Hunters posts.

    <<<3. Has anyone been able to contact Chuck's former coach to verify these events, if he was hosting them under the perview of USJA, or were these simply "local events"?>>>

    Why do you assume his coach hosted these events? The Shiai was held on an Air Force Base, NOT his school. Have you read all the things needed to host a Shiai?

    <<<My skepticism hinges on a number of issues. First, it is a fact that one does NOT need to be a member of any Judo organization to host an event. This is a plain, simple, hard, logical fact.>>>

    No sir, this is plain falsehood. To host a JUDO event, you will have to do as Mark Hunter said.

    <<<Whether or not other clubs as members of national organizations are willing to participate is another issue, but it is a fact that these events could have taken place. >>>

    Did you not see where the official rep. from Judo came on and explained why this is impossible.

    <<<Further, it is a fact that Chuck's old coach could have either been misleading people into thinking they were USJA events, or perhaps unwittingly believing they were USJA sanctioned and were not and that he felt he was following proper form. >>>

    While this is true in the dojo, it is NOT true the second they leave the dojo and enter a public Judo event.

    <<<Additionally, what I do know about insurance indicates that one does NOT need to be a member of any national martial art organization to obtain coverage for gyms or events, so it is entirely possible that these events were covered properly.>>>

    Again, the President of USA Judo, Ohio came on here and explained why this is not the case for Judo. You continue to act as if Judo shiai are ran like the unregulated martial art world. This is not the case.

    <<<Lastly, with all due respect to your experience, knowledge, and history, you cannot assign probabilities to any of the above, because you were not there and you do not have firsthand knowledge of these events.>>>

    Clearly you are in the tank for Chuck. Did I miss the part where you made that point about ANY of his investigations? Sorry, but this is the part that shows people you do not apply the rules fairly. You are sounding more like Ralph Severe with every line.

    <<<Again, maybe there is more that I am missing or missed in my reading. If someone can definitively show me the posts WITH links that are damning AND the posts where said claims are refuted WITH links, then I am 100% open to any corrections and any conclusion coming of this. But for now, I haven't seen anything that is 100% damning.>>>

    Either did Ralph Severe, your point? It is all here for anyone who has the eyes to see......
    "Out of every hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back." -- Hericletus, circa 500 BC
      #60
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