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  1. CrackFox is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/21/2010 4:30pm

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     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    How do power-clean?

    So I used to do Stronglifts, but recently I switched to Starting Strength - mainly because Stronglifts was designed by some guy with a website, and Starting Strength was developed by Mark bloody Ripptoe.

    Anyway, the one problem with this is that I can't do power-cleans to save my life. I really want to start making power cleans part of my workout though as I want to develop more explosive power for when I'm fightin 'n' ****. So, what's the best way to stop sucking at this lift?

    There was a seminar on Olympic lifts recently, but I missed it, and I don't know when another one is coming. I'm looking into getting coached, but I'm not sure any of the trainers in my gym would be the best people to ask. (I've only ever seen anyone do an olympic lift once in my gym ever.) There's also an olympic lifting club in town, but I'm not sure if I can get coaching without becoming a member.

    How long would it take to get coached to the stage where you can do starting strength safely and effectively? Would it be stupid to just try and learn it on my own?
  2. Emevas is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/21/2010 5:31pm

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The some guy with a website still designed a good routine. What are Mark Rippetoe's credentials aside from "some guy with a book"? Who exactly has he trained?

    The inclusion of power cleans in a beginner program was one of my beefs with Starting Strength, which is actually why I advocate Stronglifts for a beginner. Additionally, people with low starting limit strength won't be able to do much in terms of power generation initially anyway, so the PCs aren't that useful. In all honesty, you can develop explosive power with regular lifts by just training them explosively. Joe DeFranco talks about this a lot in his training, and it's what Dynamic Effort is all about.

    I know I didn't answer your question (I don't do any power cleans), but maybe something to think about.
    "Emevas,
    You're a scrapper, I like that."-Ronin69
  3. Lindz is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/21/2010 5:57pm

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     Style: Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Why not join the club? They're pretty rare. You're actually lucky to have one close by. Don't learn from anyone at a regular gym, or football players. They think they know how but are usually clueless.

    In general you want your cleans to look something like this
    YouTube- Ronny Weller in Atlanta 1996
    The only big differences should be the weight on the bar and how high you catch it. If they tell you or allow you to do anything like pulling quickly straight off the floor, catching the weight with vertical forearms, jumping much wider than shoulder width, using arm strength, trying for hang time, jumping back or forward then they suck

    You need a coach and weeks of practice to get even barely competent.
  4. CrackFox is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/21/2010 5:58pm

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     Style: Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    The some guy with a website still designed a good routine. What are Mark Rippetoe's credentials aside from "some guy with a book"? Who exactly has he trained?
    You might not be too impressed by Ripptoe, but Medhi's qualifications are that he's totally read like a million books. But I suppose that's immaterial, I do like his routine.

    Anyway, I've been doing stronglifts for a while and I felt like changing things up up a bit, but not too much, so I thought I'd give this a go.

    In all honesty, you can develop explosive power with regular lifts by just training them explosively.
    I used to do this with my squats until relatively recently, when I decided to try and bump up the weight. I'll probably go back to doing this at some point.

    Joe DeFranco talks about this a lot in his training, and it's what Dynamic Effort is all about.
    I'll take a look.
  5. CrackFox is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/21/2010 6:01pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lindz View Post
    Why not join the club? They're pretty rare. You're actually lucky to have one close by.
    You see my style field? You see the way it says "Occasionally MT"? You want me to change it to "Occasionally judo, occasionally MT, occasionally olly lifts"?
  6. Lindz is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/21/2010 6:04pm

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     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If you want to learn the lifts correctly you'll have to dedicate some time to them
  7. CrackFox is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/21/2010 6:13pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lindz View Post
    If you want to learn the lifts correctly you'll have to dedicate some time to them
    Why is nothing ever easy?

    Seriously though, I'm finding this hard to phrase without sounding like I'm half-arseing things, but basically here goes: I don't want to win any competitions, I just want to be able to do the lift safely, and secondarily in a way that will benefit my overall fitness. Will this really require regular coaching, or could I get away with a few sessions every fortnight or so?
  8. Emevas is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/21/2010 7:10pm

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     Style: Boxing/Wrestling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by CrackFox View Post
    You might not be too impressed by Ripptoe, but Medhi's qualifications are that he's totally read like a million books. But I suppose that's immaterial, I do like his routine.
    Yeah, I'm aware of Mehdi's qualifications (they're the same as mine), but again, his routine is sound. I actually like it more than Starting Strenght. With a beginner program especially, it's possible to craft a good one either by accident or intentionally. Regardless of who, why or how, a good program is a good program.

    I like Mehdi's inclusion of work capacity stuff in a beginner program, which Rippetoe lacks, the higher volume for a beginner, and the lack of complicated lifts like cleans. As Lindz noted, they're a very technical lift. The time invested in learning how to do them is time you can invest in getting bigger, stronger and faster.

    Here's some good reading on alternatives to olympic lifting

    http://articles.elitefts.com/article...gman-training/

    http://articles.elitefts.com/article...otball-part-1/

    http://articles.elitefts.com/article...otball-part-2/
    "Emevas,
    You're a scrapper, I like that."-Ronin69
  9. Lindz is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/21/2010 8:22pm

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     Style: Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by CrackFox View Post
    Why is nothing ever easy?

    Seriously though, I'm finding this hard to phrase without sounding like I'm half-arseing things, but basically here goes: I don't want to win any competitions, I just want to be able to do the lift safely, and secondarily in a way that will benefit my overall fitness. Will this really require regular coaching, or could I get away with a few sessions every fortnight or so?
    How much time do you devote to lifting now?

    Once you learn them half way decently you shouldn't have such a problem doing them on your own. You'll learn to feel if it's right or not. So regular coaching in the beginning then however you like later on. I think. I've never actually attempted much in the way of O lifting without a coach.
  10. LarsCG is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/07/2010 6:40am


     Style: Judo/Roadwork

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Currently doing SL5x5 without access to a squat rack, so I've been using some fugly version of Power Cleans to rack up the barbell for Front Squats.

    Did SL5x5 set A on Monday just before lunch, then went to Judo training (first time in 6-7 months - damn good to be back on the mat...) the same afternoon. Didn't quite get enough rest for today's set B, and my laughably bad form on Power Cleans showed through - I failed to get the barbell racked (currently at 65 kg/140 lbs) and pulled an assortment of interesting little muscles in my upper back + something in my left bicep area when I tried to put the barbell down in a controlled fashion.

    I've found this webpage with some tips on how to learn Power Cleans, and I'll try to follow it next time I do SL5x5 (I'll give myself a long-ish break to heal up):
    http://www.athletesacceleration.com/powerclean.html

    TL;DR - Power Clean = not easy. There are (in my admittedly n00by opinion) good advice availlable. Qualified instruction in person is preferred.

    Oh, and getting older sucks. Soreness lasts forever...

    Regards,
    Lars
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