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  1. Devil is online now
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    His heart was visible, and the dismal sack that maketh excrement of what is eaten.

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    Posted On:
    5/28/2010 1:57pm

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark View Post
    I don't clean my gun very well or very often. Though I also don't shoot as many rounds as some people on the internet seem to.

    For some reason I thought you had to do more to the guide rod than you do I have since watched a youtube video of a guy installing one. I am not really concerned about installation anymore.

    I am concerned with spending $300 on something I use so infrequently though which is why I'm still leaning toward the Uni Max one. I can get it for like $160 and it has a ton of positive reviews.
    I would recommend a proper cleaning and lubing ASAP. If you shoot just a few rounds through the weapon, then let it sit without a cleaning for an indefinite period of time, you can have problems.

    Honestly, a dirty weapon is much more of a threat to your safety than not having lasers, lights, optics, etc. Break it down and give it a good cleaning. Give the metal components a light coat of oil. The last thing you want is for two dudes to kick down your door and you get one round off before you have a jam. Not good.

    Be truthful with yourself. If you know you don't like to clean weapons and you're not likely to do it, go with a revolver instead of a semi-auto.

    As for accessories - I like lasers but I think a good light is more important for home defense. I think someone else recommended the laser / light combo. Love 'em.
  2. Anna Kovacs is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/28/2010 2:34pm

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     Style: Dancing the Spears

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark View Post
    I don't clean my gun very well or very often. Though I also don't shoot as many rounds as some people on the internet seem to.

    For some reason I thought you had to do more to the guide rod than you do I have since watched a youtube video of a guy installing one. I am not really concerned about installation anymore.

    I am concerned with spending $300 on something I use so infrequently though which is why I'm still leaning toward the Uni Max one. I can get it for like $160 and it has a ton of positive reviews.
    I've got a Uni-Max green. It's on my rifle. It's pretty rad. The laser is so bright that it's pretty much a weapon in and of itself.

    On the downside the switch can get flipped easily and kill your batteries. It also has to be sighted in

  3. Anna Kovacs is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/29/2010 1:49pm

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     Style: Dancing the Spears

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Money View Post
    With a Kel-Tec RFB - I want.
    To be honest it felt kind of clunky. it works, no doubt, Very manageable and a cool idea. (especially if you need an ambidextrous weapon) But personally I wouldn't go for one myself. Didn't like the ergonomics, Didn't like the controls. didn't like the look. Didn't like the handling.

    If I wanted a gun in that caliber I'd probably just go for Ye Olde M14 variant.

    If I just wanted a bullpup then I'd probably go for one of the 5.56 entries (and did by getting my girlfriend to choose an AUG).


    If I really really wanted a 308 bullpup...

    Well then maybe I'd go for the RFB since it's the only one I am aware of.
    Last edited by Anna Kovacs; 5/29/2010 1:55pm at .
  4. Anna Kovacs is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/29/2010 1:56pm

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     Style: Dancing the Spears

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark View Post
    I am concerned with spending $300 on something I use so infrequently.

    Guns are all about spending lots of money on something you're going to use relatively infrequently. get into the spirit of things!
  5. Don Gwinn is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/29/2010 2:02pm

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     Style: Guns

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The knock on lasers came from people thinking a laser would replace sights and, more to the point, replace marksmanship. But lasers don't guide bullets and they don't replace sights, of course. They *are* sights. They do have a few advantages over iron sights:

    1. They're visible in the dark, of course. On the other hand, until the last couple of years the tradeoff was that they were very hard to see in sunlight, and the brighter the day, the less likely you were to find your "dot." Combine that with the sweeping popularity of red-dot optics and the lasers took a hit. Nowadays they're brighter and the green ones especially have changed this. I recently got to use a Viridian green unit on a sunny day in Tennessee on a white-gravel range and it was clear as day.

    2. By putting your sight on the target, they allow you to focus on the target and forget trying to see in different focal planes. Again, this is very useful, but red-dot single-plane optics give you the same advantage.

    3. For training purposes, they put your sight picture where others can see it. You can video your training or just have someone else watch it, and they'll see the gun's movement translated into the dot. They'll see it dip low if you flinch, left if you drag the trigger, and they'll see how it moves in recoil. In Todd Jarrett's class, my dot went up and left, came down and right, back to the left and up, and finally settled back on target in recoil. Jarrett's dot went just as high in recoil, but bobbed up and down along almost a straight line and never dipped below the target.

    I have the Crimson Trace grips on a Para .45, and I like them a lot. They don't require a lot of thought to use. If you've got them switched on, just pick up the gun in a firing grip and the dot should appear. The only thing I dislike about them is that I tend to cover the laser with my trigger finger when it's not on the trigger, which is minor.

    I just picked up a SIG-Sauer light/laser combo to try out. I didn't really get it for the laser; I was looking for a light to go on my XD (and if you don't understand why it's a giggle gun, text "XD" to a teenager a few times and see what they say) and a friend saw these at the NRA convention for dirt cheap, so I asked him to get me one. This is the only thing I see challenging the Crimson Trace/Lasermaxes of the world with a larger laser unit that has to go on an accessory rail--combinations of lasers with lights. I bought it for the light, but I'll use the laser in training, and who knows? The gun doesn't have night sights yet, so maybe it'll come in handy. The part I'm more excited about is the strobe feature; I didn't know this light had it, and it looks like it's very easy to use (set to strobe, shut off light. When you hit the light button again, it will strobe white light.)

    If I were in the market for yet another laser unit and looking for the next cool thing to try out, I'd look at Viridian's combinations of lights with green lasers. Like the SIG-Sauer light/laser, they address the biggest glaring weakness of Crimson Trace: buying a laser that fits one firearm extremely well, but won't fit most others. I can't use my CT grips on anything but a Commander-length 1911 clone, but I can put the SIG light on anything with a Picatinny rail.

    Hell, I could mount it on a Battle Mug, set it to laser and strobe, and have my own party wherever I go.
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  6. Robstafarian is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/29/2010 5:26pm


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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Don Gwinn View Post
    The knock on lasers came from people thinking a laser would replace sights and, more to the point, replace marksmanship. But lasers don't guide bullets and they don't replace sights, of course. They *are* sights. They do have a few advantages over iron sights:

    1. They're visible in the dark, of course. On the other hand, until the last couple of years the tradeoff was that they were very hard to see in sunlight, and the brighter the day, the less likely you were to find your "dot." Combine that with the sweeping popularity of red-dot optics and the lasers took a hit. Nowadays they're brighter and the green ones especially have changed this. I recently got to use a Viridian green unit on a sunny day in Tennessee on a white-gravel range and it was clear as day.

    2. By putting your sight on the target, they allow you to focus on the target and forget trying to see in different focal planes. Again, this is very useful, but red-dot single-plane optics give you the same advantage.

    3. For training purposes, they put your sight picture where others can see it. You can video your training or just have someone else watch it, and they'll see the gun's movement translated into the dot. They'll see it dip low if you flinch, left if you drag the trigger, and they'll see how it moves in recoil. In Todd Jarrett's class, my dot went up and left, came down and right, back to the left and up, and finally settled back on target in recoil. Jarrett's dot went just as high in recoil, but bobbed up and down along almost a straight line and never dipped below the target.
    All of the above (particularly the feedback during range time) are why I'm keenly interested in getting a laser for my 1911. I keep hearing great things about Crimson Trace, but I love my Hogue wrap-around grips and don't want to go back to simple side panels. The LaserMax guide rod laser seems like a good alternative, but it costs almost as much as my 1911 did.

    Are there any cheap lasers that are actually worth buying? Something that will attach to a Picatinny rail would work, since I remember seeing a cheap rail that attaches to a 1911 trigger guard (and is well regarded).
    Quote Originally Posted by Snake Plissken View Post
    cuz FastPass on Indiana Jones was like being a ghetto rock star.
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    But graffiti isn't a bowl of fruit...
    Quote Originally Posted by Robstafarian View Post
    Merely insulting you is not an ad hominem fallacy: them calling you an idiot would be ad hominem if they said "You are an idiot, therefore your argument is invalid."

    What is instead happening is thus:
    1. Your argument is bullshit.
    2. You keep repeating, and expanding upon, your argument.
    3. Therefore, you are an idiot.

    That isn't an ad hominem fallacy; that's inductive reasoning.
  7. Anna Kovacs is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/29/2010 5:51pm

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I really think the guide rod lasers are the way to go. Doesn't change the profile of your gun so you can still use it with any holster. Your laser is protected from damage and is very unlikely to get turned on accidentally (My main complaint with the Uni-max is that it accidentally gets switched on and kills batteries) Also they guide rod is so in line with your bore they don't need to be sighted in and wont lose that zero, either.
    Last edited by Anna Kovacs; 5/29/2010 5:55pm at .
  8. Don Gwinn is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/29/2010 6:07pm

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     Style: Guns

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I've heard people bitch about having to activate the Lasermax units with switches on the frame, but that's not that different from anyone else except Crimson Trace, and looking at what Crimson Trace comes up with for guns without grip panels I can see why people don't prefer them on Glocks, XDs, etc.

    I should have mentioned the holster issue, but being from Illinois, it doesn't come up often for me. The gun I'm putting the light on will travel in a glovebox or stay in a Gunvault next to the bed, so I don't care about the profile.

    There are holsters that deal with lights and other attachments, for instance by holding the gun with a plug in the muzzle and nothing surrounding the gun itself, but they're generally not concealment pieces.
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  9. Anna Kovacs is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/29/2010 6:24pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Gwinn View Post
    I've heard people bitch about having to activate the Lasermax units with switches on the frame,



    On the sig it's right where my trigger finger indexes on the draw. Before I sold my 92fs I had the uni-green on the rail and I didn't care for that setup as much as the sig+guide rod laser.
    Last edited by Anna Kovacs; 5/29/2010 6:29pm at .
  10. IMightBeWrong is online now
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    Posted On:
    5/29/2010 9:39pm


     Style: 9mm/Judo/BJJ/MT

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by AnnaTrocity View Post
    I really think the guide rod lasers are the way to go. Doesn't change the profile of your gun so you can still use it with any holster. Your laser is protected from damage and is very unlikely to get turned on accidentally (My main complaint with the Uni-max is that it accidentally gets switched on and kills batteries) Also they guide rod is so in line with your bore they don't need to be sighted in and wont lose that zero, either.
    I would agree with you if those Lasermax Guides had a feature to switch between constant on and strobe. They say they only use strobe because "the eye picks up on the strobe better", but I think they did it because it maximized battery life in something inherently less capable of holding power and then used that excuse to try to convince their customers otherwise.
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