8th grader with a bully problem

**Matt Phillips** · Posted On: 5/19/2010 9:54am

Originally Posted by ciscodog

I dont want the kid to get in trouble with school or have his mom come back bitching he got suspended, but it seems like the school admins/teachers have already dropped the ball since this is already an ongoing problem. The mom must not have alot of faith in the school to handle this if she brought him to us. Tonight we will go with crossing the gap, take down and dominate position

YES

and getting the attention of an adult for help.

NO.

The kid just proved he can handle himself, if you teach him to do this he goes right back to being a rat-bitch in the eyes of his peers and the bully. If you mount him, they will come... (Lebel, shut UP!)

**Uglybugly** · Posted On: 5/19/2010 10:05am

bully problems. A bully pick on others because it makes him feel better. He choose victims because they are easy to target. Bullys are like trolls in the way they poison other people's environment because they have their own issues.

However if the goal is to help the victim then you must figure out what makes the bully able to pick on him. This does not mean that it is the victims fault that he is being bullied but the victim still has to deal with the situation.
The Gracie's made some excellent material about this YouTube- Gracie BULLYPROOF - "Verbal Jiu-Jitsu"

**Lebell** · Posted On: 5/19/2010 10:08am

goddamnit, bjj isnt the answer to everything.
fucking nutriders..

**Matt Phillips** · Posted On: 5/19/2010 10:08am

Originally Posted by Lebell

oh, and we still need more to know bout his mom.
srs.

This is the only footage of her I was able to dig up on the web You Tube - Bullied Kids Mom Really Knows How To Relax:pottytrai

**Matt Phillips** · Posted On: 5/19/2010 10:13am

Originally Posted by Uglybugly

bully problems. A bully pick on others because it makes him feel better. He choose victims because they are easy to target. Bullys are like trolls in the way they poison other people's environment because they have their own issues.

However if the goal is to help the victim then you must figure out what makes the bully able to pick on him. This does not mean that it is the victims fault that he is being bullied but the victim still has to deal with the situation.
The Gracie's made some excellent material about this YouTube- Gracie BULLYPROOF - "Verbal Jiu-Jitsu"

2 things:

1) The question was how-do defend yourself when the punch is in the air.
2) I'm sure this stuff works great in Sao Paulo on a friday night(!)

**Devil** · Posted On: 5/19/2010 10:13am

I know as an instructor, you can't tell the kid this...

But if it was my son, I'd tell him to find a weapon and beat the dog **** out of the kid. Take the lock off his locker and loop it on a leather belt. That works nicely.

When I was in the seventh grade, one of my friends put his lock in his hand with the clasp over his finger like brass knuckles and laid out this gargantuan missing link girl who had been relentlessly fucking with him. It was epic.

A good sturdy book works well, too. Whatever is handy. Obviously, I wouldn't recommend stabbing the little **** with a pencil or anything, although he probably deserves it. That would just cause too much of a **** storm.

Schools don't do **** to kids for whacking someone with a random blunt object. If it's something that's actually designed to be a weapon, people get their panties in a bunch. If it's something the kid picked up in the hall, nothing serious will happen. He'll get suspended from school. Big deal. It's eighth grade. Colleges don't look at records from middle school. He should whip some ass and make an impression that people will remember.

**Matt Phillips** · Posted On: 5/19/2010 10:19am

Originally Posted by devil

I know as an instructor, you can't tell the kid this...

But if it was my son, I'd tell him to find a weapon and beat the dog **** out of the kid. Take the lock off his locker and loop it on a leather belt. That works nicely.

When I was in the seventh grade, one of my friends put his lock in his hand with the clasp over his finger like brass knuckles and laid out this gargantuan missing link girl who had been relentlessly fucking with him. It was epic.

A good sturdy book works well, too. Whatever is handy. Obviously, I wouldn't recommend stabbing the little **** with a pencil or anything, although he probably deserves it. That would just cause too much of a **** storm.

Schools don't do **** to kids for whacking someone with a random blunt object. If it's something that's actually designed to be a weapon, people get their panties in a bunch. If it's something the kid picked up in the hall, nothing serious will happen. He'll get suspended from school. Big deal. It's eighth grade. Colleges don't look at records from middle school. He should whip some ass and make an impression that people will remember.

Bar of soap, pocket full of change, or an apple. Place in extra sock from locker and get busy.

But the king of all improvised weapons is the "Millwall Brick"

YouTube- Millwall Brick

Try it... you'll see ;)

**DdlR** · Posted On: 5/19/2010 10:38am

Originally Posted by Mtripp

The skills of closing the gap, clinching, take downs and position are about the only ones safe to use in a public school setting. Moreover, the concepts of Dr. Webster-Doyle need to be given much more time than most people care to.

This is all good advice. You should check whether his school has a "zero tolerance for fighting" policy; chances are that it does. At worst, that means that any effective physical action he takes in his own defense is likely to be interpreted as "fighting" by the school administration and lead to his being suspended or expelled (or, sad and ridiculous but true, even arrested).

Some schools are starting to modify zero tolerance policies to take circumstances such as self defense into account, but I wouldn't rely on that. We now have a whole generation of teachers and administrators who have been conditioned to think that "it takes two to fight" and that it is always possible to "just walk away".

Either way, I would train him take an obviously defensive stance (like a boxing guard but with the hands open) and to loudly say "I don't want to fight!" before and during the bullying incident. Witnesses and security cameras may miss the technical details of physical action, so if he has time before it goes down he should make a big (tactical) show of how he is "the victim" and is trying not to fight.

If the bully is injured it's highly likely that the school will punish the defender regardless, so any takedowns should be as safe as possible; upper-body takedowns that protect the bully's head from impact with the floor are best.

Finally, as Mtripp suggested re. Dr. Webster-Doyle, good conflict resolution and conflict management skills can be trained through role-playing and are at least as valuable as physical defense skills.

**maofas** · Posted On: 5/19/2010 10:51am

I don't even need to think about this one:

1. Teach him to throw a right hand.
2. Flash focus mitts, have him throw, then defend focus mitt haymakers by answering the phone (and make sure he's not turning his eyes away).
3. Then get him to answer the phone and fire back.
4. Repeat, but do it moving around like you're fighting.

Clinching, trips, all the stuff is nice, but will take longer to develop. So will a good punch, but a shitty right hand works much better than a shitty throw as it actually does something.

Now, mind you I was a schoolteacher for 5 years. And yes, I'd recommend Judo for kids if they want to defend themselves without getting into trouble, BUT...

He is not going to get sent to Juvie hall for punching a kid. Remember this other kid is punching him every day and seems to be evading authority. I know the 10 o'clock news makes everyone think that if a kid so much as uses harsh language in self-defense they're carted off the school property in leg irons, but I'm telling you that is the extremely rare exception which makes for a good newstory because it's both uncommon and riles parents up into wanting to watch ("oh noes that could be my little bundle of joy!").

Oh don't get me wrong, the teachers might break it up, his mom will be called, he'll be in the principals office and they'll try to make him feel bad about it. Big fucking whoop. If he gets in any serious trouble, it's very simple, have the mom raise hell. Just make sure he knows not to kick the kids head off if he manages to knock him down...because he probably hates this fucking kid by now.

Schools have very little actual authority which is why stuff like this happens in the first place to a large extent and will back down from an angry parent over something like this 99% of the time. "Oh you want to do X to my child? How about I sue your school for negligence for allowing the situation to go on so long? Where's the supervision?"

Most of the time when kids actually do get in serious trouble over something minor like this, it's kids who don't have a parent to come to school and fight for them (i.e. single mom working). The worst that will happen is he'll get suspended for day or two which will probably feel like deep **** to a good kid, but it's a joke (doesn't affect your grades and isn't going to keep him out of his choice of college or whatever).

Talk to the mom a bit IMO, but not like Lebell wants to.

**ciscodog** · Posted On: 5/19/2010 10:54am

WW a vid couldnt hurt, and im going to talk to mom again tonight to see if she can give more insight to exactly what is going on and what steps shes taken to stop the bullying such as talking to school officials etc. No lebell im not taking pics of her for you, lmao.