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  1. battlefields is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/14/2010 7:11pm

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     Style: BJJ/ MMA/ MT

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Simple question regarding kuzushi.

    Probably a really simple question to answer, but I'm curious. Is kuzushi governed by principle/ method, or is it something that is developed during randori?

    I think that the games we "play" in class assists in gaining the "feeling" and awareness of when your opponent is off balance. I am just wondering if, at higher levels, there are specific exercises, or if randori is that specific exercise.
  2. jnp is offline
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    Titanium laced beauty

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    Posted On:
    3/14/2010 8:41pm

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: BJJ, wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Missing posts moved here: More off topic posts in the technique fora - No BS MMA and Martial Arts


    I understand mistakes can happen. I just made one myself by giving an infraction when I meant to only give a warning. Regardless, I ask that members pay attention to what forum in which they're posting.

    Now back to battlefields question. . .
  3. Plasma is online now
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    Posted On:
    3/14/2010 9:46pm

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     Style: 柔術

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Kuzushi comes from drilling and randori together. In drilling you learn to take their kuzushi and execute your throw. During randori you'll learn to either apply the "Drill" or more commonly capitalize on a mistake or technique of your opponent.

    Lets take a classic example. Tomoe Nage. First you drill it , pulling your opponent forward and you sit under kicking them over. During randori is where you learn that when your opponent drives into you they are giving you their kuzushi for a Tomoe Nage.

    Coach Josh and MTripp will be around shortly you give their opinion how they teach kuzushi.
  4. theotherserge is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/14/2010 9:47pm

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     Style: sambo/crossfit

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    its both, from my experience.

    Kuzushi is something you approach like a drill, you are trying to get a feel for breaking-balance/attacking the posture of your uke. This creates the next step: debana/"opportunity"

    I think that to drill your footwork, kuzushi, uchikomi etc it is never done. Watch the old salts at work and you see them doing the same drills they did when they first started. Its how we keep our pathways wired.

    Ignore the fact that this is in French, it will become obvious how awesome this is...

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JTEJpigD1_E
    Many things we do naturally become difficult only when we try to make them intellectual subjects. It is possible to know so much about a subject that you become totally ignorant.
    -Mentat Text Two (dicto)
  5. Lindz is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/14/2010 9:59pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    How can you prevent your movement/balance attacks being used against you? Is it a matter of the exact amount of force no more no less or something more arcane? For example if I want to do osoto gari I could push my opponent back to create kuzushi. But the same movement give my opponent an opportunity for ko ouchi gari.
  6. Plasma is online now
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    Posted On:
    3/14/2010 10:07pm

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     Style: 柔術

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lindz View Post
    How can you prevent your movement/balance attacks being used against you? Is it a matter of the exact amount of force no more no less or something more arcane? For example if I want to do osoto gari I could push my opponent back to create kuzushi. But the same movement give my opponent an opportunity for ko ouchi gari.
    It may be just a bad example. But if you drive in and off balance someone for a O Soto Gari, their back will be arched back and they can't pull of a Ko Uchi Gari. However, you are vulnerable to a Yoko Wakare. In that case, that is the game. Can you off balance but stay in control of your own? That takes practice and randori.
  7. Lindz is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/14/2010 10:21pm

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     Style: Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Maybe I shouldn't have named specific techniques. It just seems that no matter which way I push or pull trying to set up something I always end up on my back with my own energy used against me.

    If it's because I'm a whitebelt and just need to stfu and train then fine.
  8. theotherserge is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/14/2010 10:26pm

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     Style: sambo/crossfit

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Plasma View Post
    It may be just a bad example. But if you drive in and off balance someone for a O Soto Gari, their back will be arched back and they can't pull of a Ko Uchi Gari. However, you are vulnerable to a Yoko Wakare. In that case, that is the game. Can you off balance but stay in control of your own? That takes practice and randori.
    Absolutely, that is the game. You initiate something, your uke/opponent counters, you counter, etc etc What can you do in any given situation and how can you create that situation or respond to their initiaive?

    This is how, from a "small" group of favorite waza, you can develop a very complex and varied Judo skill-set.
    Many things we do naturally become difficult only when we try to make them intellectual subjects. It is possible to know so much about a subject that you become totally ignorant.
    -Mentat Text Two (dicto)
  9. Mtripp is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/14/2010 10:33pm

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     Style: Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    In my never to be humble opinion....

    You drill the crap out of one hard core throw. This means getting the grip you want, and then attacking full bore to hit that throw. Do NOT worry about silly things like being counter thrown, attack hard.

    Now, either you will throw him, or he will defend. That defense will open him to your second attack.

    Study Yamashita's work and you will understand this...
    "Out of every hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back." -- Hericletus, circa 500 BC
  10. Plasma is online now
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    Posted On:
    3/14/2010 10:35pm

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     Style: 柔術

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Lindz View Post
    Maybe I shouldn't have named specific techniques. It just seems that no matter which way I push or pull trying to set up something I always end up on my back with my own energy used against me.

    If it's because I'm a whitebelt and just need to stfu and train then fine.
    Pretty much. The key thing is not to get discouraged. At the moment "train more" is really the best advice we can offer you. The biggest danger I see at this stage is people not wanting to get thrown so they start to fight real defensive and stall. That just will hinder your progress and your partners.

    Just keep drilling your throws and then try it in randori. Randori isn't about winning per say as it about bringing your techniques to the level where you can pull them off on a resisting opponent.

    I'll give you a quick war story from last Friday. I was sparring MMA with one of the pro fighters at my gym. He is much better wrestler and Jiu-Jitsu guy than I am. Regardless, I still ducked his jab, and snatch the single leg and finished with a Ko Soto Gari. I did this twice and each time he was able to get out of my top half guard and make me pay for those takedowns. Even though I know he has the skill and power to reverse my takedowns I still go for them anyway and that is the only way to get better.
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