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  1. JohnnyCache is offline
    JohnnyCache's Avatar

    All Out of Bubblegum

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    May 2004
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    10,473

    Posted On:
    3/06/2010 7:38pm

    supporting memberforum leader
     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Did I just log into bullshido or the july 1994 issue of Black Belt Magazine?

    I like how this is three big hooligans that attacked with a big crocodile dundee knife, failed to fight as a team, didn't bother using their numbers, etc

    I like how every stroke snaps a bone

    I like how the guy feels huge guilt over ALMOST killing a guy but nothing really about crippling them

    I like how the Euro Bystander was a Euro Hippie about the whole thing, and then the Euro Cops acted their part as well.

    I like all aspects of this clearly made up story
    There's no choice but to confront you, to engage you, to erase you. I've gone to great lengths to expand my threshold of pain. I will use my mistakes against you. There's no other choice.
  2. Mtripp is offline
    Mtripp's Avatar

    Choked out by Gene Lebell

    Join Date
    Jul 2005
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    Grand Blanc, MI
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    3,276

    Posted On:
    3/06/2010 7:48pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I am coming late to the dance; but in my never to be humble opinion....

    1. The elbow break is possible, even probable.

    2. The collarbone break is possible, but unlikely.

    3. The sidekick breaking the shin bone is VERY unlikely and perhaps impossible.

    Now, that said, there is merit to the discussion. Things like "when you disarm him, to the law the fight is over, you can't kill him with his own knife," are important issues because the law does see it that way. Of course the line is "I took it away from him, he tried to take it away from me and I knew if he did he would kill me with it," are important to remember.

    But, my best suggestion. After such an event, is to say you are having chest pains, tell them you need to go to the hospital, AND KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT from then on. Just hold your chest and wince a lot.

    Once there, they will notify your ICE (in case of emergency) from your cell phone and you should tell them to call a lawyer. Do not talk about the event until you have calmed down and you have had legal advise.
    "Out of every hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back." -- Hericletus, circa 500 BC
  3. Justin C is offline

    Registered Member

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    Jan 2010
    Posts
    27

    Posted On:
    3/06/2010 8:23pm


     Style: W.H.S.F.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I have seen an instructor in a father son team doing an exhibition play acting fight on stage where the kid hit the wrong mark and round house kicked his dad in the back and caused several broken bones so......Ill take the op on good faith and believe him.Sides I REALLY REALLY want to be able to break a bone with a kick so far to old and fat.
  4. Omega Supreme is offline

    Administrator

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    May 2011
    Location
    West Coast
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    Posted On:
    3/06/2010 9:08pm

    staff
     Style: Chinese Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Justin C View Post
    I have seen an instructor in a father son team doing an exhibition play acting fight on stage where the kid hit the wrong mark and round house kicked his dad in the back and caused several broken bones so......Ill take the op on good faith and believe him.Sides I REALLY REALLY want to be able to break a bone with a kick so far to old and fat.

    I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.
  5. It is Fake is offline
    It is Fake's Avatar

    Administrator

    Join Date
    Jan 2005
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    33,609

    Posted On:
    3/06/2010 10:32pm

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Justin C View Post
    I have seen an instructor in a father son team doing an exhibition play acting fight on stage where the kid hit the wrong mark and round house kicked his dad in the back and caused several broken bones so......Ill take the op on good faith and believe him.Sides I REALLY REALLY want to be able to break a bone with a kick so far to old and fat.
    Go ahead no one is stopping you. I've seen injuries, in Demos, where no one is blocking or expecting **** to go south. It doesn't validate anything working in real time.

    A demo, with no threat of Life or Death, is not the same as a street Fight.
  6. TheRuss is offline
    TheRuss's Avatar

    is badder than you

    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Not Canada
    Posts
    4,335

    Posted On:
    3/06/2010 11:58pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: None

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Basho View Post
    OK, my troll senses are firing here
    Pretty sure everyone else covered this already, but... uh huh.

    Quote Originally Posted by Basho View Post
    I have done the necessary in daring (gulp) to post on Bullshido.
    No, what's necessary is for you to verify that the story you're relating is substantially true. Newspaper article, police report, CCTV footage, something.
    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    Downstreet on the flip-flop, timepants.
  7. Kid Miracleman is offline
    Kid Miracleman's Avatar

    Rowsdower!

    Join Date
    Jan 2007
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    Parts Unknown!
    Posts
    3,249

    Posted On:
    3/07/2010 1:55am

    Join us... or die
     Style: On Hiatus

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Breaking a collarbone with an "upper rising elbow?" Doesn't the use of both "upper" and "rising" make that redundant?

    Anyway, I have trouble seeing how such a technique could break a person's collarbone... assuming that this is a 6-o'clock-to-12-o'clock (uppercut-like) strike where the point of contact is the tip of the elbow, it seems to me that it would just graze/cut the upper pectoral region. However, even this only seems probable if the guy being struck is shirtless and not wearing a t-shirt/sweater/coat/what-have-you, in which case it wouldn't do much damage at all.

    I guess what I'm really trying to say is that I like pie.
  8. DDangelo is offline

    Featherweight

    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Posts
    51

    Posted On:
    3/07/2010 2:13am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    God, I love this website. When I saw this story, I was immediately skeptical, but I said to myself "It's on the front page, so surely...". I'm glad that isn't the case :)
  9. MGM is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Pilot Point, AK
    Posts
    174

    Posted On:
    3/07/2010 2:36am


     Style: Bartitsu&German Longsword

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Perhaps there was excessive farce.
  10. madmonkey is offline

    Registered Member

    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    united kingdom
    Posts
    341

    Posted On:
    3/07/2010 8:12am


     Style: Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    description of the event sounds to clean cut from "Raymonds" point of view. If there was more of a struggle between the group and Raymond ie they grabbed him and he managed to get out a kick or a "upper rising elbow" which were fortunate enough to have connected it would sound more plausible. Perhaps it has just been simplified too much or taken too much from one persons point of view. Though it does read like the classic martial arts mugging story.

    In regard to UK law the police would have turned up on scene received two or three different accounts of the events, victim, offender, witness. Due to discrepency between them they would have arrested all people actually involved, probably ON SUSPICION of section 3 of public order act AFFRAY or ON SUSPICION of assualt or in the case of the offenders carrying a bladed article.

    REMEMBER an ARREST DOES NOT AUTOMATICALLY MEAN A PERSON IS GUILTY it is simply a method which ensures prompt investigation of the crime and for the police to gather as much evidence as possible although there must obviously be enoung grounds for the police officer to suspect you of the offence. YOU CAN BE DEARRESTED IN SOME CASES

    UK LAW DOES NOT expect you to curl up in a ball BUT it does want you to use only as much force as is necessary (ie what a reasonable man would deem reasonable). EG A drunk swings for you aggressively, you defend yourself by hitting him before his fist connects. AT this point most would argue you have been reasonable in your use of force. The drunk falls to the ground and you then start to kick him in the ribs THIS is when you have potentially crossed the line as you could run away. THE common legal defence would be that you thought he was going to get up and threaten you again.

    In this case if "Raymond" was able to deliver these blows so easily, knew what the results of such blows would be and intended those results and could have done something differently then he might well have been guilty of using excessive force. Like anything else it comes down to what you can PROVE in court.

    Good example of this in UK recently
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2009/de...ar-cricket-bat

    though I believe their sentences have since been reduced/quashed?
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