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  1. hellis is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/28/2010 7:49am


     Style: Traditional Aikido

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Is Aikido a Martial Art ?

    DAyoung

    I do try to avoid discussions on the writings of OSensei as each person quoting him have their own interpretation, which in turn suits their excuse for their take on Aikido. In the UK in the 1950s there was simply " Traditional Aikido " . I could never have imagined the variations that are on offer today.


    DCS
    The best source of information on Tadashi Abe Sensei would be Pierre Chasang from Paris, he is now 87 yrs old, he was the first student of Tadashi Abe in France in 1952. I met Chasang Sensei again about four years ago and he was still teaching.

    I spoke with TK Chiba Shihan recently when we me at the old ` Hut Dojo ` . He said that Tadashi Abe Sensei was his hero, he added that Abe Sensei had trained as a one man suicide submariner, as he qualified the war ended, for the rest of his life he felt that he himself had been cheated or denied his true destiny.

    Tadashi Abe was without doubt that hardest man I have ever met in my 74 yrs. He would carry a knife and when in a confrontation ( which was often ) he would take out the knife and offer it to his opponent, he said to me that a man without a weapon was not a challenge.
    In 1967 he went back to Japan and visited the AikiKai Hombu, he was furious at what he saw being taught there as Aikido. Abe Sensei later returned and spoke loudly for all to hear, he first apologised to the ladies saying he meant them no offence as he then spoke """ This is not Aikido !! this is for women """
    He then threw his AikiKai diploma's on the mat and walked out, never to return. There are some excellent photos of Tadashi Abe Sensei on the photo galleries at www.british-aikido.com

    Henry Ellis
    http://aikidoarticles.blogspot.com
    Last edited by hellis; 3/28/2010 8:21am at .
  2. daishi is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/28/2010 9:59am


     Style: Aikido/JJJ/Judo/GoJu Ryu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    DAYoung,

    I am surprised your experiences with Aikido are as you describe. I've always considered AUS to be a Yoshinkan-influenced country and, in my experience with that influence of aikido, I encountered little talk about M. Ueshiba outside of historical context..and certainly no deification of him or any other teachers. We also have little talk about ki, but take a more studious approach to technique, while having a very traditional and vigorous approach to training. I've been to many aikido dojo in my travels and found a very limited number of places I would be willing to train at full time.
  3. DCS is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/28/2010 11:34am

    Join us... or die
     Style: 柔道

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    Quote Originally Posted by DAYoung View Post
    On the other hand, I do think discussion of Ueshiba's possible delusions are relevant. For example, it's quite possible he was an exemplary fighter, but a poor philosopher - and his philosophies have perverted his own martial teachings.
    Mystics usually make poor and/or abstruse philosophers.
  4. DAYoung is offline
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    Crouching Philosopher, Hidden Philosopher

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    Posted On:
    3/28/2010 2:36pm

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     Style: n/a (ex-Karate)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by hellis View Post
    I do try to avoid discussions on the writings of OSensei as each person quoting him have their own interpretation, which in turn suits their excuse for their take on Aikido. In the UK in the 1950s there was simply " Traditional Aikido " . I could never have imagined the variations that are on offer today.
    Yes, fair enough. Thank you.
    Martial Arts and Philosophy: Beating and Nothingness
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  5. DAYoung is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/28/2010 2:41pm

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     Style: n/a (ex-Karate)

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by daishi View Post
    DAYoung,

    I am surprised your experiences with Aikido are as you describe. I've always considered AUS to be a Yoshinkan-influenced country and, in my experience with that influence of aikido, I encountered little talk about M. Ueshiba outside of historical context..and certainly no deification of him or any other teachers. We also have little talk about ki, but take a more studious approach to technique, while having a very traditional and vigorous approach to training. I've been to many aikido dojo in my travels and found a very limited number of places I would be willing to train at full time.
    I've heard from an American colleague that Australia is softer than the US, where she trained.

    And I've certainly encountered the deification - though more outside the dojo (e.g. people writing about him) than within. But they must get their approach from somewhere - I'm assuming it's their teachers.

    But as I say: my experience is limited. I did not train in Aikido for very long.
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  6. DAYoung is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/28/2010 2:42pm

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     Style: n/a (ex-Karate)

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    Quote Originally Posted by DCS View Post
    Mystics usually make poor and/or abstruse philosophers.
    Which is fine, if you don't use them as a handbook for practical skills.

    "The Meister Eckhart Guide to Home Repairs"
    Martial Arts and Philosophy: Beating and Nothingness
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  7. daishi is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/28/2010 7:25pm


     Style: Aikido/JJJ/Judo/GoJu Ryu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ...I was thinking particularly of Joe Thambu Sensei...thought he was out of Melbourne, but could be wrong. I've only seen him on video but he seems to produce more of a robust practice of aikido, being Yoshinkan and all. Oh well, just curious....always wanted to find a chance to attend one of his events. Have a good one,
    cheers!
  8. DAYoung is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/28/2010 7:49pm

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     Style: n/a (ex-Karate)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yes, Shudokan is in Melbourne. I've come across Thambu Sensei in Blitz, but not trained there. It'd be good to hear from some of the students.
    Martial Arts and Philosophy: Beating and Nothingness
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  9. daishi is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/28/2010 7:59pm


     Style: Aikido/JJJ/Judo/GoJu Ryu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I agree...if your interested he has plenty Thambu Sensei's clips on youtube. I see you're a GoJu stylist...I would have gone to a seminar with Motoo Yamakura Sensei (GKK) today but I had to work instead...it was only something like $20 USD! Oh well, off topic but I thought you'd find that interesting.
  10. DCS is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/29/2010 10:56am

    Join us... or die
     Style: 柔道

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    Quote Originally Posted by DAYoung View Post
    Which is fine, if you don't use them as a handbook for practical skills.

    "The Meister Eckhart Guide to Home Repairs"
    Define "practical skills"

    2008. Kohn, T. "Creatively sculpting the self through the discipline of martial arts training", in Dyck, N. (ed) Exploring Regimes of Discipline:The Dynamics of Restraint, Oxford: Berghahn Books, pp. 99-112.
    Last edited by DCS; 3/29/2010 11:04am at .
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