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  1. PADLOCK is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/14/2010 12:37am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    4th degree Black Belt Draculino's thoughts on Gracie Universites Online belts

    [yt]sKZ0pFBUGlM[/yt]

    This is an interview, with questions coming from sherdoggers. They asked me the questions, I took 'em to Drac and filmed his answers. The 2nd question refers to the highly controversial topic of online belts...and Drac had ALOT to say about it :) enjoy!
  2. searcher66071 is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/14/2010 12:55am


     Style: Karate-knockdown, BJJ

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    You have a link?
  3. 1point2 is online now
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    Posted On:
    2/14/2010 1:31am

    Join us... or die
     Style: 剛 and 柔

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    What a disgrace it is for a man to grow old without ever seeing the beauty and strength of which his body is capable. -Xenophon's Socrates
  4. dig7six is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/14/2010 2:46am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I gotta say, the interview didnt come across to me as he was against the ideas of transmitting teaching via the web or videos etc, but that he wouldnt be handing out belts by watching some guy rolling on a video.

    I think thats great, take out the handing out of rank, but make the instruction available. He said he would have to spend at least a week with a guy to see and feel how he moves and how he has internalized the techniques,..again all good. i oersonally think it would take longer, but what do i know.

    I saw this video posted on a thread about Gracie combatives and i have to say, while they have obviously more of a marketing approach, they are pretty serious about it and make it clear that your rank doesnt mean much of ****, and that you are in no way representing The gracie academy.

    I also know you cant even try for a black unless you go out there to them and no they dont charge for you to test.

    they also say for those who put together a group a "Gracie garage" that they will be randomly coming out to teach at your garage and help you along..something to do with a draw of some sort. either way, i think that does say they are pretty serious about what they are doing..oh and its free for them to come and roll with you if your garage is the one drawn that cycle or whatever.

    Also i found interesting they said, if your ever challenged dont feel like you have to represent and fight for them,..but to call them and they will handle it. Does that mean anything ? I dont know and really dont care, but i appreciate being lied to with flare even if it isnt true.

    i know saying anything defensive of the Gracie combatives is prolly not going to earn many points around here, but all in all im a firm believer in you can learn alot of things from video with a good training partner and attention to detail, and sometimes its the only access to the information one can get, and some training is better than no training IMO.

    your not going to be better than the guy who rolls at a gym with high level guys all the time, but your better off doing that then some other goofy martial art with no real chance of pulling it off if you should ever need to,..if nothing else your getting educated and gaining humbleness and respect for those who do go to an actual Bjj gym, and at least know that the techniques that you are trying are proving effective techniques against a resisting opponent. Thats better than hours of solo "white crane stands on donkey dick"

    But rank i agree, doesnt mean anything when it comes easy.

    Excuse me, i got to go and clean my Gracie juice bag.
  5. Diesel_tke is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/14/2010 9:15am

    supporting member
     Style: stick,Taiji, mountainbike

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    Quote Originally Posted by dig7six View Post
    Excuse me, i got to go and clean my Gracie juice bag.

    HA! Good stuff!!!
    Combatives training log.

    Gezere: paraphrase from Bas Rutten, Never escalate the level of violence in fight you are losing. :D

    Drum thread

    Pavel Tsatsouline: kettlebell workouts give you “cardio without the dishonour of aerobics”.
  6. Punisher is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/14/2010 11:47am

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     Style: Five Animal Fighting

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    There's been plenty of debate around here. As an instructor I strongly feel rankings should represent skill, but it is up to the instructor/school/organization on what the student needs to do to prove that skill.

    I respect Draculino and his opinion, but I personally find his standard of proof to be a little high, although from his own personal history his standards are understandable (e.g. having to defeat Brown Belts in competition before his instructor would promote him from blue to purple). There are plenty of well respected black belts, who will promote students at seminars after rolling with them for 15 or twenty minutes. They do not need to observe someone for a full week to evaluate their skill.

    IMO, denying a person ranking for bullshit reasons is just as bad as awarding a ranking to someone who doesn't deserve it. I've heard of schools that REQUIRE students to show their loyality by getting a tatoo before be awarded certian rankings. That has nothing to do with skill and is bullshit. So are things like minimum time requirements. Skill is skill no longer how long it takes to obtain. If, as unlikely it would be, someone came in off the street and tapped Draculino and all of his other black belts despite having no formal ranking in BJJ, I would hope that Draculino would promote him to black, not blue, purple, or brown.
  7. PADLOCK is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/14/2010 4:45pm

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     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Punisher View Post
    There's been plenty of debate around here. As an instructor I strongly feel rankings should represent skill, but it is up to the instructor/school/organization on what the student needs to do to prove that skill.

    I respect Draculino and his opinion, but I personally find his standard of proof to be a little high, although from his own personal history his standards are understandable (e.g. having to defeat Brown Belts in competition before his instructor would promote him from blue to purple). There are plenty of well respected black belts, who will promote students at seminars after rolling with them for 15 or twenty minutes. They do not need to observe someone for a full week to evaluate their skill.

    IMO, denying a person ranking for bullshit reasons is just as bad as awarding a ranking to someone who doesn't deserve it. I've heard of schools that REQUIRE students to show their loyality by getting a tatoo before be awarded certian rankings. That has nothing to do with skill and is bullshit. So are things like minimum time requirements. Skill is skill no longer how long it takes to obtain. If, as unlikely it would be, someone came in off the street and tapped Draculino and all of his other black belts despite having no formal ranking in BJJ, I would hope that Draculino would promote him to black, not blue, purple, or brown.
    This is my opinion, and I will get his opinion and post it here as well in response to this. But first off, it wasn't a REQUIREMENT to tap out browns to get promoted. He was saying that there were parts of his game that he was lacking....and some things he excelled at. His instructor was building a champion and was leaving him at a belt so that he could achieve a certain confidence in himself and acquire a level of skill at each belt.

    The fact that he was tapping out early brown belts as a late blue is a consequence, not a requirement. To Drac, giving out a belt ESPECIALLY a black belt is more than just skill, its about character as well. Draculino wouldn't want some punk who went around beating women and raping kids representing him...and neither would I. (I know thats an extreme but I'm making a point). Meeting someone for 15 min and giving them a belt without knowing them and letting them for ever represent you isn't very smart in my opinion.

    Not to mention anyone can do anything in 15 minutes...I've rolled with a brown belt world champion as a blue belt just a few days ago who tapped me out only once and then I tapped him out with a triangle. We were 1 and 1 for that 15 minutes. If you were to look at that match alone you might say I should be promoted....but you would be wrong. He kicks my ass ALL the time.

    I caught a black belt with a rolling loop choke once. That doesn't prove anything...the black belt murdered me consistently through out that week. If you judged me just by one of those instances, you wouldn't know my holes and my weakness...if you would of watched me the whole week, you would of saw a more accurate picture.

    I for one am happy Draculino is this way...when I get my belts...I KNOW that I deserve them. I know I don't have a belt because he is just trying to pump them out or to make money. I know that I can go compete competently against any other person in my division. When I get my black belt there will be no question on whether or not I deserve it or whether or not my instructor is proud of me.
  8. Punisher is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/14/2010 6:29pm

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     Style: Five Animal Fighting

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by PADLOCK View Post
    This is my opinion, and I will get his opinion and post it here as well in response to this. But first off, it wasn't a REQUIREMENT to tap out browns to get promoted. He was saying that there were parts of his game that he was lacking....and some things he excelled at. His instructor was building a champion and was leaving him at a belt so that he could achieve a certain confidence in himself and acquire a level of skill at each belt.

    The fact that he was tapping out early brown belts as a late blue is a consequence, not a requirement. To Drac, giving out a belt ESPECIALLY a black belt is more than just skill, its about character as well. Draculino wouldn't want some punk who went around beating women and raping kids representing him...and neither would I. (I know thats an extreme but I'm making a point). Meeting someone for 15 min and giving them a belt without knowing them and letting them for ever represent you isn't very smart in my opinion.

    Not to mention anyone can do anything in 15 minutes...I've rolled with a brown belt world champion as a blue belt just a few days ago who tapped me out only once and then I tapped him out with a triangle. We were 1 and 1 for that 15 minutes. If you were to look at that match alone you might say I should be promoted....but you would be wrong. He kicks my ass ALL the time.

    I caught a black belt with a rolling loop choke once. That doesn't prove anything...the black belt murdered me consistently through out that week. If you judged me just by one of those instances, you wouldn't know my holes and my weakness...if you would of watched me the whole week, you would of saw a more accurate picture.

    I for one am happy Draculino is this way...when I get my belts...I KNOW that I deserve them. I know I don't have a belt because he is just trying to pump them out or to make money. I know that I can go compete competently against any other person in my division. When I get my black belt there will be no question on whether or not I deserve it or whether or not my instructor is proud of me.
    I mostly agree with what you said, however there are some tough questions that every instructor must face.

    Part of me says the an instructor's standard should be the same for everyone. If Draculino's instructor felt his game was lacking in certain areas, such as his top game was purple/brown level, but his bottom game was blue, fine. If Draculino's instructor was holding back ranking because "he was building a champion" and was holding Draculino to a higher standard than any other student he was teaching I might have a problem with that.

    On other side, I know how frustating to have a naturally talented student who doesn't push himself to reach his full potential. If an instructor has two students, one who is not natually talented, and still struggles despite busting his ass and making the most out of what God gave him and another who is an athletic freak who has great skill without working that hard, who is the instructor to promote? One? Both? Neither? These are the questions an instructor has to face.

    As far as the character thing, if someone wants to require s Black Belt to be a good person as well as good fighter fine. If everyone followed that they world would probably be a better place, but they don't. I know a lot of assholes with belts of all colors.

    But what if an instructor says he won't promote women, or gays, or blacks? Sounds extreme? While few instructors will openly admit it, I've run across several who wll not promote people for just such reasons.

    More commonly I've seen instructors promote "yes men" who kiss their ass over more talented students who don't "show the proper respect". I personally witnessed one such test, where two students were going for the exact same ranking and basically performed identically during the test. One was promoted and one wasn't. The reason? The instructor felt disrespected that only one of the students decided to spend the money to attend his seminar the night before the test. Guess which one passed?

    I also agree that anything can happen in 15 minutes. It is not surprising to me than even a white belt can get lucky, or in a brief flash of genius, can tap a black belt. You're right, that really doesn't prove anything. But what if that white belt dominated for the entire 15, or at least held his own with out the black belt holding back. That doesn't happen by accident.

    I'm glad you respect your instructor, that you believe his rankings have true meaning, and that when he gives them out know he is proud of you. It appears Draculino makes his rankings hard to get for the right reasons. All I am saying is there are instructors out there who's ranking are hard to get for the wrong ones.
  9. PADLOCK is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/14/2010 7:19pm

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     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

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    Quote Originally Posted by Punisher View Post
    I mostly agree with what you said, however there are some tough questions that every instructor must face.

    Part of me says the an instructor's standard should be the same for everyone. If Draculino's instructor felt his game was lacking in certain areas, such as his top game was purple/brown level, but his bottom game was blue, fine. If Draculino's instructor was holding back ranking because "he was building a champion" and was holding Draculino to a higher standard than any other student he was teaching I might have a problem with that.

    On other side, I know how frustating to have a naturally talented student who doesn't push himself to reach his full potential. If an instructor has two students, one who is not natually talented, and still struggles despite busting his ass and making the most out of what God gave him and another who is an athletic freak who has great skill without working that hard, who is the instructor to promote? One? Both? Neither? These are the questions an instructor has to face.

    As far as the character thing, if someone wants to require s Black Belt to be a good person as well as good fighter fine. If everyone followed that they world would probably be a better place, but they don't. I know a lot of assholes with belts of all colors.

    But what if an instructor says he won't promote women, or gays, or blacks? Sounds extreme? While few instructors will openly admit it, I've run across several who wll not promote people for just such reasons.

    More commonly I've seen instructors promote "yes men" who kiss their ass over more talented students who don't "show the proper respect". I personally witnessed one such test, where two students were going for the exact same ranking and basically performed identically during the test. One was promoted and one wasn't. The reason? The instructor felt disrespected that only one of the students decided to spend the money to attend his seminar the night before the test. Guess which one passed?

    I also agree that anything can happen in 15 minutes. It is not surprising to me than even a white belt can get lucky, or in a brief flash of genius, can tap a black belt. You're right, that really doesn't prove anything. But what if that white belt dominated for the entire 15, or at least held his own with out the black belt holding back. That doesn't happen by accident.

    I'm glad you respect your instructor, that you believe his rankings have true meaning, and that when he gives them out know he is proud of you. It appears Draculino makes his rankings hard to get for the right reasons. All I am saying is there are instructors out there who's ranking are hard to get for the wrong ones.
    I can agree with what you said, to touch on some points though. My understanding is that his team was held to those high standards. Your talking about Carlos Gracie Jr, Renzo and the machado brothers themselves, not Johnny black belt. I think EVERYONE should hold high standards when it comes to giving out black belts, I know the dangers of not doing so.

    I earned my black belt in Tae Kwon Do from a world champion fresh out of korea. A guy that was tuff, and had kids, 5 and 7 year olds, literally doing push ups with there knuckles on concrete when they messed up, and slapping them in the back of the head with the double red and blue kick pads. **** that will get you sued in America lol. I went on to win every single city and state sparing tournament and took 2nd in nationals at the jr Olympics. It was hard to achieve belts from him as well and was far different from the American business model tae kwon do schools of today.

    With all the low standards of today, I watched that belts atrophy crumble to the pitiful thing it is now....its practically worthless to anyone but me. The last thing I want this to happen to is jiu-jitsu...I've devoted my life and my career to this sport and I don't want to see 5 year old black belts running around or having online jiu-jitsu warriors embarrassing themselves and the sport.

    Man, you would really have to train under him to see it, but draculino is the real deal, a real old school who is resolute in his character. He isn't swayed by money or fame. You wouldn't believe the ridiculous things I see him get offered money for that he denies because it doesn't meat his standards and isn't honest. He is the funniest guy in the world off the mat, on the mat, besides his good nature and humor, all that remains is ethics and business.

    He doesn't understand the meaning of shortcut or cheating and I'm pretty sure your health or your ego is at risk if you ask him for either to his face. Drac is 100% fair, you speak of someone off the street coming in and tapping him out...and would he promote him. When you first come to the school, especially when you have other martial arts or grappling training...you go through an evaluation period.

    The first month he watches you intently and even rolls with you himself. At the time of your first promotion he awards you accordingly..I've seen some black belt judo guys get 4 stripes on their first promotion and some old Olympic judo competitors receive blue belts their first promotion. Some wrestlers get 3 stripes on their white belt....and even I got two my first promotion after consistently beating most one stripe white belts in every situational training situation.

    NOW, after that first MONTH of evaluation, you are placed into the curriculum and you follow the minimum time AND skill requirement for each promotion thereafter. I think this is absolutely fair to HIM and the student and can't really find anything negative about it.
  10. PADLOCK is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/14/2010 7:26pm

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     Style: Brazilian Jiu-Jitsu

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    You gotta remember too....hes not selfish with them..when you earn it, you earn it. This guy has over 100 black belts and numerous past and even current world champions. The guy truly has successful teaching down to a science. He has only been and Texas for 2 years and our young school took all the major team titles in our area in the adult and kids divisions from the ADCC to the Atama open.

    If it was one or two people in his school being successful you could argue luck when everyone everywhere he goes is successful its because of instruction.
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