[Training] Camp Skeletor August 2010

**7thSamurai** · Posted On: 1/01/2010 5:30pm

Originally Posted by Lord Skeletor

But...do you give better footrubs than Phrost does? That's the REAL QUESTION, sir!

I have softer hands. I moisturize.

**Lord Skeletor** · Posted On: 1/02/2010 11:18am

Originally Posted by 7thSamurai

I have softer hands. I moisturize.

<perk> :lookround

**Ming Loyalist** · Posted On: 1/02/2010 7:27pm

how much should we be looking to spend on a pair of airsoft guns? the ones i see (even at wall mart) are $170+ each. is there a "good enough" version that is super cheap?

i may be able to borrow some from my friend, but i was just curious.

**Wounded Ronin** · Posted On: 1/02/2010 7:28pm

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think he just means you need something that resembles a firearm and can shoot little balls.

**Lord Skeletor** · Posted On: 1/04/2010 11:22pm

Originally Posted by Ming Loyalist

how much should we be looking to spend on a pair of airsoft guns? the ones i see (even at wall mart) are $170+ each. is there a "good enough" version that is super cheap?

i may be able to borrow some from my friend, but i was just curious.

Dude...get a cheap, "hop" up air pistol for like $5.00. You can get any number of air rifles for like $8-9 bucks. Don't go crazy, man.
http://www.hobbytron.com/AirsoftPistols.html

they've got all kinds of cheap ****. Just remember...as long as you can pull the trigger, you'll be fine. I'll have an equipment list posted in a couple of weeks when we finalize the dates.

**beringc** · Posted On: 1/05/2010 9:56am

Originally Posted by Lord Skeletor

Looks like we have a lot of people asking for August. Optimal would be Wed-Sun. We could train Wed, Thurs, Fri (with maybe a scenario thrown in on Friday evening), and finish up with a range day on Saturday, giving everyone a chance to get home on Sunday. A couple of people have asked already, but we're going to keep all training limited to airsoft weapons ONLY. Simply put...it's not that I don't trust you fuckers....but I don't trust you fuckers. :5flowerfa Given that the group spans from the very trained (military/LE guys) to the untrained (novice firearms users), we have to cater to the lowest common denominator to ensure safety. When you get home, you can put nearly all of these skills to use in protecting yourself, family, friends, and home during an emergency.

Again, I don't ask for any sort of compensation....other than deciding what it is you want to shoot and perhaps shipping me out some ammo to help out the overall effort. I can't buy ammo for everyone because I'm a poor dude, but I can donate a little to the cause. I have nearly every manner of assault gun you can think of, some full autos, SBRS, handguns, shotguns, sniper guns, etc.

I would put aside about $25.00 for an airsoft pistol and carbine (you can get these very cheap, either online or locally [Wal-Mar]). And perhaps a holster of some sort, preferably with a retention device (although not mandatory) and a FLASHLIGHT. DO NOT GO OUT AND SPEND A FUCKTON OF MONEY ON ANYTHING. That would defeat the purpose of helping you guys out, especially those with limited funds. YOU DON'T NEED TO SPEND MONEY TO GET GOOD TRAINING. Hell, if you can't afford a softair gun, fucking tell me, I'll find you something.
__________________________________________________ ______

Based upon y'alls requests, the class would look something like this (I can change it to accomodate what you guys want to do):

Wednesday

I. Introduction to Close Quarters Battle
a. Weapons Selection/Usage/Retention
b. Room Searches
c. Building Searches
d. Team Movement
e. Vehicle Assaults

Thursday

II. Basic CQB
a. Long Hallways
b. Interconnecting Rooms
c. Basic SWAT/CQB Problems (T-Intersections, 3/4-Way Intersections,
L-Shaped Hallways, and Dead Ends)
d. Stairways (Up and Down)
e. Use of Force/Weapons Retention/Defensive Tactics

Friday

III. Low Light Operations
a. Use of Flashlights/NVG-NODS/Lasers
b. Team Movement at Night
c. Low Light Survival
d. Observational Drills/CQB Drills
1. Team Scenario #1 (Lighted)
2. Team Scenario #2 (Dark)

Saturday

IV. Range Day
a. Shoot all kinds of ****
b. Blow **** up

If you noticed, most of this is structured around team concepts and working together. This is no accident. I'm going to throw you together as a team, we'll choose random team leaders as the day progresses, giving everyone a chance to lead and learn from both your own wins and failures---as well as those of your teammates. This is one of the best motivators out there to ensure that everyone understands the material and everyone can do what they've been taught.

SOME/MANY of you might have seen/experienced stuff like this before...just try to roll with it, until we get everyone caught up and able to at least keep up with your skill level.

So.....

It's cool that you are offering to increase peoples skill for no money, and I'm sure everyone that will show or who inhabits this forum have the best intentions, BUT.....

Why are you showing these types of tactics to civilians? If I want to defend my home, I don't need to practice fill and flow.

No problem if you restrict training to Military/LE, but I'm a little concerned about civilians practicing raid techniques.

However, blowing **** up is cool no matter who you are!

I'm sure you'll use your best judgement on sharing. Watch out for turbans.

**BadUglyMagic** · Posted On: 1/05/2010 10:49am

Originally Posted by beringc

So.....

It's cool that you are offering to increase peoples skill for no money, and I'm sure everyone that will show or who inhabits this forum have the best intentions, BUT.....

Why are you showing these types of tactics to civilians? If I want to defend my home, I don't need to practice fill and flow.

No problem if you restrict training to Military/LE, but I'm a little concerned about civilians practicing raid techniques.

However, blowing **** up is cool no matter who you are!

I'm sure you'll use your best judgement on sharing. Watch out for turbans.

That is a valid concern. Looking at it though, how many bangers are likely to show? Also, if really becomes a concern, those who are without appropriate ID could be background checked and waivered prior. Yes, there would be a fee involved.

If you are single fill and flow may not be necessary. If yo have a family, imo, having a coordinated f-n-f for evacuation or defense is a good idea. Most of the skills have another side to the coin if only for awareness, evasion and escape.

**Ming Loyalist** · Posted On: 1/05/2010 11:34am

Originally Posted by beringc

So.....

It's cool that you are offering to increase peoples skill for no money, and I'm sure everyone that will show or who inhabits this forum have the best intentions, BUT.....

Why are you showing these types of tactics to civilians? If I want to defend my home, I don't need to practice fill and flow.

No problem if you restrict training to Military/LE, but I'm a little concerned about civilians practicing raid techniques.

However, blowing **** up is cool no matter who you are!

I'm sure you'll use your best judgement on sharing. Watch out for turbans.

so, let me see if i understand your argument here:

Originally Posted by paraphrase of your argument

1) LEO/military types are to be trusted, but not civilians.

uhhh, why? cause LEOs and military guys have never misused their training, ever, right? no one who wears a badge or uniform could be a bad man!!! bzzz. wrong. try again.

Originally Posted by paraphrase of your argument

2) people who wear turbans are not to be trusted.

uhh? what the **** did the sikhs ever do to you? are you really that ignorant or was that supposed to be some sort of lame attempt at a joke? assuming that you don't know the difference between a sikh and a muslim, what if a muslim wanted to take part in this? would you deny them based on religion?

**Lord Skeletor** · Posted On: 1/05/2010 11:45am

Originally Posted by beringc

So.....

No problem if you restrict training to Military/LE, but I'm a little concerned about civilians practicing raid techniques.

I'm sure you'll use your best judgement on sharing. Watch out for turbans.

I've actually thought about what you're saying a great deal before this thing started; however...there are more than "just a few" circumstances where knowing how to walk down a dark hallway (or in fact with you and just somebody else--perhaps a wife or husband/friend) in a safe manner could go a long way towards saving not only your life, but a family member or friend's as well. Let's be honest...if you want to see "SWAT tactics"---hell, you can go train at nearly any of the larger "for profit schools" with absolutely no military or law enforcement credentials. They're simply after your money. If you're poor, simply log onto Youtube.com and you can watch SWAT/CQB instructional techniques all day long for weeks and still not be able to watch them all.

I'm more of a libertarian than anything else. I don't think that the police should have access to anything that your ordinary citizen shouldn't have access to. Yeah...I've been an LEO for 18 years and I still feel that way. What I'm more about is helping to establish and foster a survival mindset, mental preparedness, and good situational awareness.
I guess it's nothing more than your perspective and I appreciate your concern...however, I'm not teaching anti-cop/anti-soldier warfare, explosives deployment, ambush techniques, or anything of that nature. Simply how to move room-to-room in a safe, methodical manner (both lighted and in the dark), while emphasizing weapon retention, civil/criminal liability, and using firearms. Again...a million different scenarios in which you would want to clear your home, property, garages, or outbuildings--or protect yourself in a life-or-death type situation.

Would I share something that might comprise the lives of a rescue team or soldier? It would depend again on your perspective. Nearly anyone could interpret any basic marksmanship class, carbine class, or anything like that to be "contrary to officer/soldier safety" if you just replaced your B27/IDPA/IPSC target with that of a cop/soldier. Many places can teach you the basics of handling a firearm safely. Many places can teach you to shoot the firearm and utilize it in a safe manner. But...what I'm more about is being able to take that idea of utilizing the firearm for defense, and put it in a more practical framework and kind of combine it into a team-building exercise.

BTW, what I put up (on that proposed syllabus) is more or less something that I came up with on the spur of the moment. I've put a number of posts in here that I'd pretty much teach the guys/girls that showed up what they wanted to learn (within reason) and subject content was certainly up for discussion. However, I wouldn't necessarily include "room-to-room movement" in "raid techniques" per se. Raid techniques involve more command-level planning, target identification and surveillance, establishing/maintaining perimeters, communication, and of course...deployment. I just don't believe that simply teaching people to watch their backs, use cover, walk down hallways, how walk through doors where somebody bad might be hiding, and holding onto their weapons would necessarily endanger anyone.

I do however plan to contact a couple of the admins here as the time for the planning stages of this comes to an end to get their assistance in ensuring that the people coming are certainly forum members here in good standing and that we don't end up with people that no one is familiar with or is an inflammatory shithead. :ninja7: