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  1. kenikim is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/14/2010 1:48pm


     Style: Christopher Hitchens-do

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    yes please do, because i sure don't see your point with the links.
    are you trying to enlighten us with throws that don't require collar grips? wow, i wonder how i missed them before. these are SOOOO popular as tournament throws. there are SOOOO many tsurigoshi, ogoshi, and obiotoshi specialists, i've lost count. you probably should have mentioned ipoon seoi, but you weren't really thinking, were you?

    this is the same reasoning i heard with the new no direct attach below the belt rule. some people are saying that 'oh, it's just a handful of throws in the judo syllabus. there are many other throws in judo'.
    this is not the point!

    if i am a morote seoi specialist or high collar grip guy, the gi has neutralized me, not the opponent. i don't think anyone has a big problem with losing to a better judoka, but to lose because the gear was a factor??? only the athletes should be the factors.

    Quote Originally Posted by FictionPimp View Post
    Anyone who bitches about a gi effecting their game is a bitch. Plain and simple. I wear my stiff double weave bad ass competition gi in practice. The collar is so think you can't even choke me with it as it won't wrap around my neck.

    That doesn't stop my betters from beating the **** out of me. And their flimsy single weave doesn't give me any noticeable advantage. I'm still laying flat on my back trying to figure out how it all went wrong.

    If a gi is the difference between winning and losing, maybe you need to look at your training a bit more.

    Quote Originally Posted by FictionPimp View Post
    Anyone who bitches about a gi effecting their game is a bitch. Plain and simple. I wear my stiff double weave bad ass competition gi in practice. The collar is so think you can't even choke me with it as it won't wrap around my neck.
    and you think this is fair???
    what's wrong with you? are you trying to tell me that there is no merit in the concept of fair play???

    i can't blame the athletes who take advantage of the rules. what is what people do; they use the system to their advantage. but i find your attitude toward your 'my collar so thick, you can't choke me with it', immature and obtuse.

    how is everyone wearing gis with thick collars you can't choke with good for judo? i've heard of people starching their gi or rinsing it with an entire bottle of fabric softner AND tumble dry with 10 sheets of fabric softner, trying to get that edge.

    if you didn't think the gear mattered, why did you get that double weave with those thick collars? maybe it wasn't your intention for the collars to be that thick, it was just one of the benefits of having a double weave, but you sure seem to be proud of the thick collars and is benefiting from it. when you lost your matches, how many were via okuri eri?

    i've never personally lost a match because of my opponent's gi. i can remember moments when i thought, 'damn this is a stiff gi' when i took my grip, but you don't have time to focus on things like that when you are fighting.

    i've said it on my earlier post, and i'll c&p it again;
    "if two equally talented people stepped on the tatami, one should not walk away the victor simply because of the tayloring of the gi"
    Last edited by kenikim; 1/14/2010 2:27pm at .
  2. FictionPimp is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/15/2010 1:45pm


     Style: BJJ/Judo/Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by kenikim View Post
    yes please do, because i sure don't see your point with the links.
    are you trying to enlighten us with throws that don't require collar grips? wow, i wonder how i missed them before. these are SOOOO popular as tournament throws. there are SOOOO many tsurigoshi, ogoshi, and obiotoshi specialists, i've lost count. you probably should have mentioned ipoon seoi, but you weren't really thinking, were you?

    this is the same reasoning i heard with the new no direct attach below the belt rule. some people are saying that 'oh, it's just a handful of throws in the judo syllabus. there are many other throws in judo'.
    this is not the point!

    if i am a morote seoi specialist or high collar grip guy, the gi has neutralized me, not the opponent. i don't think anyone has a big problem with losing to a better judoka, but to lose because the gear was a factor??? only the athletes should be the factors.






    and you think this is fair???
    what's wrong with you? are you trying to tell me that there is no merit in the concept of fair play???

    i can't blame the athletes who take advantage of the rules. what is what people do; they use the system to their advantage. but i find your attitude toward your 'my collar so thick, you can't choke me with it', immature and obtuse.

    how is everyone wearing gis with thick collars you can't choke with good for judo? i've heard of people starching their gi or rinsing it with an entire bottle of fabric softner AND tumble dry with 10 sheets of fabric softner, trying to get that edge.

    if you didn't think the gear mattered, why did you get that double weave with those thick collars? maybe it wasn't your intention for the collars to be that thick, it was just one of the benefits of having a double weave, but you sure seem to be proud of the thick collars and is benefiting from it. when you lost your matches, how many were via okuri eri?

    i've never personally lost a match because of my opponent's gi. i can remember moments when i thought, 'damn this is a stiff gi' when i took my grip, but you don't have time to focus on things like that when you are fighting.

    i've said it on my earlier post, and i'll c&p it again;
    "if two equally talented people stepped on the tatami, one should not walk away the victor simply because of the tayloring of the gi"
    Actually, I own that not because I bought it for competition, but because I bought it off of a recommendation from a friend as nice fitting cheap gi. I wear it in competition because it is the only white gi I own. Obviously I was exaggerating the fact that I can't be choked while wearing it. But it is very very stiff.

    I went back to judo last night to hang out with my old friends. I wore one of the gi I use for bjj. Now this gi is loose by bjj standards, but technically illegal by judo standards (sleeves are too tapered and slightly two short due to shrinkage over time). Everyone was bitching about how tight my gi was and how hard it was to get a grip. Now I use judo throws in my bjj club all the time, in guys wearing super tight, super small gi's for bjj competition. I've never been bothered by their gis, even the ones with patches on the lapel area that make it basically twice as hard to get a good grip. I just adapted my approach to their clothing (gasp!).

    All this and I actually suck at judo. I'm not even a black belt. If I can do it, why can't the higher ranks do it as well? If they want to standardize length, weight, cut, etc I'm fine with that. But labels and review boards? Screw that, it's a money grab.

    I honestly feel like there is nothing done by judo regulating bodies recently that has been good for judo. They do nothing but make rule changes to discourage evolution and creativity, and now they are just trying to make as much money as possible and raise the cost of entry for everybody. Of course we knew that about judo already. :deadhorse
    "a martial art that has no rules is nothing but violence" - Kenji Tomiki
  3. kenikim is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/15/2010 3:56pm


     Style: Christopher Hitchens-do

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by FictionPimp View Post
    I went back to judo last night to hang out with my old friends. I wore one of the gi I use for bjj. Now this gi is loose by bjj standards, but technically illegal by judo standards (sleeves are too tapered and slightly two short due to shrinkage over time). Everyone was bitching about how tight my gi was and how hard it was to get a grip. Now I use judo throws in my bjj club all the time, in guys wearing super tight, super small gi's for bjj competition. I've never been bothered by their gis, even the ones with patches on the lapel area that make it basically twice as hard to get a good grip. I just adapted my approach to their clothing (gasp!).

    All this and I actually suck at judo. I'm not even a black belt. If I can do it, why can't the higher ranks do it as well? If they want to standardize length, weight, cut, etc I'm fine with that. But labels and review boards? Screw that, it's a money grab.

    I honestly feel like there is nothing done by judo regulating bodies recently that has been good for judo. They do nothing but make rule changes to discourage evolution and creativity, and now they are just trying to make as much money as possible and raise the cost of entry for everybody. Of course we knew that about judo already.:deadhorse
    listen, bro,
    you gotta broaden your perspective a bit more. just because it doesn't bother you, does not mean there isn't an issue. the throws that i do don't require the collar grip. my style has changed that i rely on sleeve and belt grips for my tokuiwaza because of my inherently weak wrists. if i am fighting someone though, i want my technique to win me the match. i don't want my gi to be the deciding factor. what is wrong with that?

    and i have no idea about what you meant by 'and now they are just trying to make as much money as possible and raise the cost of entry for everybody. Of course we knew that about judo already'. this only affects IJF events. EVERYBODY? hardly. neither of us ain't going near IJF events unless we're sweeping the floor at the building. this only raises the cost for those competitors and manufacturers.

    and please explain yourself by what you meant by 'Of course we knew that about judo already'.
    know what?
  4. FictionPimp is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/15/2010 4:23pm


     Style: BJJ/Judo/Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by kenikim View Post
    listen, bro,
    you gotta broaden your perspective a bit more. just because it doesn't bother you, does not mean there isn't an issue. the throws that i do don't require the collar grip. my style has changed that i rely on sleeve and belt grips for my tokuiwaza because of my inherently weak wrists. if i am fighting someone though, i want my technique to win me the match. i don't want my gi to be the deciding factor. what is wrong with that?

    and i have no idea about what you meant by 'and now they are just trying to make as much money as possible and raise the cost of entry for everybody. Of course we knew that about judo already'. this only affects IJF events. EVERYBODY? hardly. neither of us ain't going near IJF events unless we're sweeping the floor at the building. this only raises the cost for those competitors and manufacturers.

    and please explain yourself by what you meant by 'Of course we knew that about judo already'.
    know what?
    If the IFJ requires it, most gi makers will submit their gi's and roll that into the cost, raising prices for everyone. As to your favorite throws, well fighting is about adapting to the situation. What if you really really like hip throws, but your opponent happens to be 2 feet tall, are you going to ask him to wear stilts? It's not suppose to be easy.

    My last comment is that I feel the judo associations are doing their best to ruin judo. As a martial art, judo is great, as a sport if fucking blows.
    "a martial art that has no rules is nothing but violence" - Kenji Tomiki
  5. kenikim is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/15/2010 7:05pm


     Style: Christopher Hitchens-do

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by FictionPimp View Post
    If the IFJ requires it, most gi makers will submit their gi's and roll that into the cost, raising prices for everyone. As to your favorite throws, well fighting is about adapting to the situation. What if you really really like hip throws, but your opponent happens to be 2 feet tall, are you going to ask him to wear stilts? It's not suppose to be easy.

    My last comment is that I feel the judo associations are doing their best to ruin judo. As a martial art, judo is great, as a sport if fucking blows.
    ya, we'll see if the gi prices go up in general. i don't think it will, as their revenue will rise because of this, but you might be right as well. we'll see next year. but do remember that not all manufacturers will comply to this. there'll be manufactuers who will hum along just fine as they did before supplying to the recreational athletes.

    and i guess you don't know judo that well. if someone is 2 feet tall, you are damned right i'll do hip throws. shorter your opponent, easier the hip techniques.

    and i am not arguing about adapting to varying situations. i'll say it again for the third time. "if two equally talented people stepped on the tatami, one should not walk away the victor simply because of the tayloring of the gi"

    as to your last comment, i am very disappointed in IJF for the new no hands below the waist rule. but i do like the elimination of koka and the new golden rule change. matter of fact, this new greco-judo rule is the only change i think that hampers judo. i don't know how much you know about the IJF, but please make subjective judgements.
  6. FictionPimp is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/18/2010 10:44am


     Style: BJJ/Judo/Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I don't know about you, but find it REALLY hard to get my hips 12 inches from the ground, thus I could never hip throw a 2 foot midget. It's easier for me to do hip throws on people taller then me, because I'm already under their hips. I guess however that after 6 years in judo I'm just doing it wrong.
    "a martial art that has no rules is nothing but violence" - Kenji Tomiki
  7. kenikim is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/18/2010 11:33am


     Style: Christopher Hitchens-do

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by FictionPimp View Post
    I don't know about you, but find it REALLY hard to get my hips 12 inches from the ground, thus I could never hip throw a 2 foot midget. It's easier for me to do hip throws on people taller then me, because I'm already under their hips. I guess however that after 6 years in judo I'm just doing it wrong.
    you do hip throws on taller opponents and don't find yourself getting countered more often than on shorter opponents???
  8. FictionPimp is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/18/2010 2:00pm


     Style: BJJ/Judo/Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by kenikim View Post
    you do hip throws on taller opponents and don't find yourself getting countered more often than on shorter opponents???
    I'd say if they are much taller, then yes, I get countered (usually I just have problems getting in). If they are too short, then I can't get under them and I can't throw at all. I my prime targets for hip throws are guys my height or slightly taller.

    if your a good foot or two shorter then I am, then I can't squat that low fast enough (plus my knees wont take it) to even think about a legit hip throw.
    "a martial art that has no rules is nothing but violence" - Kenji Tomiki
  9. kenikim is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/18/2010 3:35pm


     Style: Christopher Hitchens-do

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by FictionPimp View Post
    I'd say if they are much taller, then yes, I get countered (usually I just have problems getting in). If they are too short, then I can't get under them and I can't throw at all. I my prime targets for hip throws are guys my height or slightly taller.

    if your a good foot or two shorter then I am, then I can't squat that low fast enough (plus my knees wont take it) to even think about a legit hip throw.
    try this next time.
    instead of trying to squat down to get down to their level, HOIST them up, either with a belt/waist grip or lapel grip. in general, shorter opponents are better target for koshi waza.
  10. CrackFox is online now
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    Posted On:
    1/18/2010 3:41pm

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     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by kenikim View Post
    try this next time.
    instead of trying to squat down to get down to their level, HOIST them up, either with a belt/waist grip or lapel grip. in general, shorter opponents are better target for koshi waza.
    I think maybe you've confused the words shorter and smaller.
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