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  1. CapnMunchh is offline

    Welterweight

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    Posted On:
    10/31/2013 9:52pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: TangSooDo/Yubiwaza

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by jspeedy View Post
    Consider switching your focus to weapons! Check out an FMA school, most of your previous training will be useful in FMA. Few non FMA people realize how versatile FMA is and how much empty hand comes into play. FMA is the evil twin of Krav, it addresses similiar topics, combatives, mult attackers, obviously weapons, but imo there is more technique involved and more to be learned.

    I look at Krav as martial arts lite, it's probably not too bad for someone who wants to train for a short period of time and have some basic options for self defense, but why the hell would you want to learn just enough to suck at every facet of martial arts? At least specialize in something and be mediocre at everything else, at least!

    I think I know some FMA guys in the VA area if you're interested.
    Don't get me wrong, I'm not necessarily joining KM permanently, I just decided to try it out, give it 3 months then reassess (they do want at least a 3 month commitment).

    I respect FMA, and actually looked into FMA schools in the area. The only one that I recall finding was Trident Martial Arts Academy, in Woodbridge, VA. If you have any info about them or know of another group, I'd certainly consider visiting them.
  2. jspeedy is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/31/2013 10:20pm


     Style: FMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by CapnMunchh View Post
    After reading this and other threads on KM on this website, I came away with these general opinions: (1) Some KM schools are more or less ok, some not, depending on the instructor and what is taught, (2) they are good to the extent that there is live training, bad to the extent they spend time on compliant uke SD drills, (3) KM is long on conditioning and aggression, shorter on teaching good technique.

    Iíve been getting a little bored with my current karate school, due to the lack of live sparring, and I miss rolling once in a while. But, I donít want to join one of the regular MMA/MuyThai/BJJ schools in my area, because theyíre expensive, expect long term contracts, and in some cases youíre also expected to join a personality cult. Plus, Iím too damn old at this point in my life to box full contact. Iím in it for the conditioning and to have a good time, and I need to be able to go to work the next day.

    So, this KM school sounds like my ticket. I was told they have light boxing sparring, and harder contact is allowed for those who want it. They have regular BJJ classes, with live sparring. I observed one of their Level 1 classes, and the conditioning aspect of the class seemed more than adequate. I donít expect to learn new technique, but I do at least expect to practice what I already know. They are reasonably priced, and donít insist on a long-term contract. They don't require camo magic pants, or a black ski mask and pajamas.

    Iíll identify the school and post a review after Iíve had a chance to attend for a while, as I donít think its fair or useful to write a review otherwise.
    Quote Originally Posted by CapnMunchh View Post
    Don't get me wrong, I'm not necessarily joining KM permanently, I just decided to try it out, give it 3 months then reassess (they do want at least a 3 month commitment).

    I respect FMA, and actually looked into FMA schools in the area. The only one that I recall finding was Trident Martial Arts Academy, in Woodbridge, VA. If you have any info about them or know of another group, I'd certainly consider visiting them.
    Let me ask around!
  3. madsox is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/31/2013 11:38pm


     Style: Mostly mixed-up FMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by CapnMunchh View Post
    Don't get me wrong, I'm not necessarily joining KM permanently, I just decided to try it out, give it 3 months then reassess (they do want at least a 3 month commitment).

    I respect FMA, and actually looked into FMA schools in the area. The only one that I recall finding was Trident Martial Arts Academy, in Woodbridge, VA. If you have any info about them or know of another group, I'd certainly consider visiting them.
    Capn - Trident is an excellent school. I've known their founder/head coach-teacher for 20 years in the DC/MD/VA FMA circles. He's good people, and I've never seen bad students come out of his club (earlier) or school.

    Depending on where you are and where you're looking, I can probably find some people to hook up with if you want to look at FMA. PM or email me if you want.

    Yeah, I'm late jumping on the thread. I just noticed it and wanted to read through at least a good part of it (longwinded buncha bastids, y'all are!) before spouting off. So now I'm throwing another opinion on the pile, FWIW.

    Happy Halloween!
  4. Vieux Normand is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/01/2013 12:22pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: 血鷲

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by madsox View Post
    He's good people...
    How many good personalities does he have?
  5. madsox is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/01/2013 1:05pm


     Style: Mostly mixed-up FMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Vieux Normand View Post
    How many good personalities does he have?
    Two that I remember - the teacher/coach (the nice one) and the fighter who knocked me around pretty well in the ring (the mean one).

    Kickboxing w/single stick in that case, and a lot of fun, but I took home some bruises!

    Lesson learned? Train harder when you're going to be fighting an active duty Navy SEAL. 8-)
  6. captainbirdseye is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/09/2013 5:38am


     Style: JJJ/BJJ

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by erezb View Post
    You don't think being an arresting officer is different when you interact with people (as in struggle with them) than if you where just a civilian?
    I think most people even when resisting arrest will hesitate throwing hard punches and kicks, they will wrestle though. People punching cops tend to get injured and jailed longer and harder than those that struggle to get free.
    BTW i also think aikido and some judo is great for a cop. Punching out someone and than handcuffing him will get you into trouble won't it.
    About that 99.9% ending on the ground, i hope you are not talking about fighting . Even rape has a smaller percentage of ending on the ground than that.
    It certainly makes no difference in my country, the legal prosecution service will not differentiate between resisting or not resisting in any meaningful way so you might as well give it a go. You never know, you might win and be able to run away.

    Back to the original topic though, I'm a krav maga instructor (I don't teach, I just have have the paperwork) and while I can't see a reason it can't be taught well, it's almost always utter ****. Like, really ****, like maybe someone, somewhere is running a good class but you'd be better off looking for the holy grail, El Dorado, Loch Ness Monster etc.
  7. newtoMA10 is offline

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    Posted On:
    11/13/2013 12:06am


     Style: Shidokan/Kajukenpo

    1
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I put Krav in the same category as Kenpo,it fills in some situational defenses that are left open by MMA/Combat sports,and the grappling and striking is decent enough that if you do it for about a year,you should be able to handle the average person on the street. You would still get your ass kicked by somebody who trains heavy in a combat sport. The value I saw in Krav is that I didnt have to spend money and time for a Combat sport and a RBSD to fill in the gaps. Krav had decent kickboxing and sparring with alot RBSD.

    Now I am going weigh in on the debate about techniques that you cant train live or in sparring are worth learning. There are techniques that you dont use in sparring ,because there are certain techniques that are too dangerous,or there are certain techniques that will not work on a trained opponent. I would like to have a multitude of techniques in my muscle memory so I train both techniques that can be trained live as well as techniques that cant happenin live training MMA has alot of gaps you can easily be put in a situation where a MMA tech is not viable at the point,and thus you have to rely on a tech that you dont train live.

    Example http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Sx8e...has_verified=1

    This was a basic Karate chop which you will never see this at a MMA school sparring session tournament. Nobody who is even half way trained is going to let you Karate chop them,but that tech was in his muscle memory and was effective though it was low percentage tech it was ideal for that situation. Karate chops to the throat ,eye gounges,kicks to the groin all fall under these kinds of techs.

    On the subject of techniques that will not work on trained opponents there are alot throws in Judo,but you only see a handful of them in grappling tournaments and even fewer of those techs in MMA tournament,its because alot of Judo throws rely on the opponent over committing when they strike which is something that even novice martial artist tend not do in controlled sparring sessions. These techs are still good for self defense,because a deranged attacker is likely to over committ out of agression,which make those judo throws as well as other TMA and RBSD techs viable.
    Last edited by newtoMA10; 11/13/2013 12:15am at .
  8. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/13/2013 12:40am

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    2
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Now I am going weigh in on the debate about techniques that you cant train live or in sparring are worth learning. There are techniques that you dont use in sparring ,because there are certain techniques that are too dangerous,or there are certain techniques that will not work on a trained opponent. I would like to have a multitude of techniques in my muscle memory so I train both techniques that can be trained live as well as techniques that cant happenin live training MMA has alot of gaps you can easily be put in a situation where a MMA tech is not viable at the point,and thus you have to rely on a tech that you dont train live.
    I remember when I used to build these arguments. MMA and BJJ have been around long enough to negate this "gap" belief that people constantly bring up. In MMA competition I've seen joint locks, eye gouges, bites, hair pulling, nut shots and even the dreaded Karate chop.
  9. Devil is offline
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    His heart was visible, and the dismal sack that maketh excrement of what is eaten.

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    Posted On:
    11/13/2013 8:53am

    supporting member
     

    3
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by newtoMA10 View Post
    I put Krav in the same category as Kenpo,it fills in some situational defenses that are left open by MMA/Combat sports,and the grappling and striking is decent enough that if you do it for about a year,you should be able to handle the average person on the street. You would still get your ass kicked by somebody who trains heavy in a combat sport. The value I saw in Krav is that I didnt have to spend money and time for a Combat sport and a RBSD to fill in the gaps. Krav had decent kickboxing and sparring with alot RBSD.

    Now I am going weigh in on the debate about techniques that you cant train live or in sparring are worth learning. There are techniques that you dont use in sparring ,because there are certain techniques that are too dangerous,or there are certain techniques that will not work on a trained opponent. I would like to have a multitude of techniques in my muscle memory so I train both techniques that can be trained live as well as techniques that cant happenin live training MMA has alot of gaps you can easily be put in a situation where a MMA tech is not viable at the point,and thus you have to rely on a tech that you dont train live.

    Example http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Sx8e...has_verified=1

    This was a basic Karate chop which you will never see this at a MMA school sparring session tournament. Nobody who is even half way trained is going to let you Karate chop them,but that tech was in his muscle memory and was effective though it was low percentage tech it was ideal for that situation. Karate chops to the throat ,eye gounges,kicks to the groin all fall under these kinds of techs.

    On the subject of techniques that will not work on trained opponents there are alot throws in Judo,but you only see a handful of them in grappling tournaments and even fewer of those techs in MMA tournament,its because alot of Judo throws rely on the opponent over committing when they strike which is something that even novice martial artist tend not do in controlled sparring sessions. These techs are still good for self defense,because a deranged attacker is likely to over committ out of agression,which make those judo throws as well as other TMA and RBSD techs viable.
    Failure to incorporate nut shots and eye gouges into your training routine is not a fucking gap.

    Show me an RBSD nerd who has had all the "gaps" filled in his training, but whose foundation is built on subpar training of the fundamentals (which is exactly what you have with Krav). I'll show you a zillion kids with a year of high school wrestling who will skullfuck your wannabe killing machine without even breaking a sweat.
  10. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    11/13/2013 9:16am

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    3
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I am always shocked that people use the "muscle memory" excuse for dead training. I used that over twenty years ago and it still comes up. Here's the problem with this argument, most attacks in their specific range, start out similar.

    For example, to say an eye gouge is something different than a punch to the nose is ridiuclous. The mechanics are basically the same, the hand configuration is different. So, the sport fighter who is good at sidestepping a lead straight is going to be good at dodging an eye gouge as well.

    Before the butt-hurt begins I didn't say not to train these techniques or that they don't work. I am addressing the subtle argument that dangerous/dead techniques are gaps in sport arts.
    Last edited by It is Fake; 11/13/2013 9:19am at .
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