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  1. Diesel_tke is offline
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    Light Heavyweight

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    Posted On:
    5/08/2010 7:56am

    supporting member
     Style: stick,Taiji, mountainbike

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well, that stuff that went on at Abu Ghraib was pure disgusting. Simple as that. But I am not so naive as to believe that 90 percent were innocent either. But that doesn't excuse the treatment.

    They should have sent prison guards over there to run their prisons. Not a bunch of green soldiers. That same **** would happen in US prisons if you didn't have experienced officers walking around policing their own. It is easy for a detainee to make a green officer do **** they normally wouldn't. That is why you have experienced officers around to maintain composure and keep the idiots under control.
    Combatives training log.

    Gezere: paraphrase from Bas Rutten, Never escalate the level of violence in fight you are losing. :D

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  2. vigilus is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/08/2010 10:43am


     Style: Yoshinkan Aikido, MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Were the US soldiers Military Police? Or did they fill out the prison with just anyone?
    You are not free whose liberty is won by the rigour of other, more righteous souls. Your are merely protected. Your freedom is parasitic, you suck the honourable man dry and offer nothing in return. You who have enjoyed freedom, who have done nothing to earn it
  3. TheRuss is offline
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    is badder than you

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    Posted On:
    5/08/2010 11:41am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by GuiltySpark View Post
    Were the US soldiers Military Police? Or did they fill out the prison with just anyone?
    Wikipedia says that Graner was a prison guard before joining the reserves, and an MP (at least at some point) while there.
    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    Downstreet on the flip-flop, timepants.
  4. Matt Phillips is offline
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    NOTE TO SELF - MOAR GRAPPLE - GET A NORMAL HAIR CUT - REPEAT

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    Posted On:
    5/08/2010 11:56am

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I understand why people are upset by this; I'm upset by this. But if the guy was already in custody, then there are rules in play. If he got roughed up resisting capture, then I 100% agree this is BS, but if he was zip-tied to a chair and getting laid into by sailors for emotional reasons then the behavior is an insult to the standards of their service and the oath they swore at enlistment.

    Just my $0.02
    Now darkness comes; you don't know if the whales are coming. - Royce Gracie


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  5. Diesel_tke is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/08/2010 12:18pm

    supporting member
     Style: stick,Taiji, mountainbike

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by TheRuss View Post
    Wikipedia says that Graner was a prison guard before joining the reserves, and an MP (at least at some point) while there.

    Well, if that article is even 50% accurate, then that guy needs to be locked up somewhere. Makes you wonder where they are recruiting from.
    Combatives training log.

    Gezere: paraphrase from Bas Rutten, Never escalate the level of violence in fight you are losing. :D

    Drum thread

    Pavel Tsatsouline: kettlebell workouts give you “cardio without the dishonour of aerobics”.
  6. TheRuss is offline
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    is badder than you

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    Posted On:
    5/08/2010 1:59pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by diesel_tke View Post
    Well, if that article is even 50% accurate, then that guy needs to be locked up somewhere. Makes you wonder where they are recruiting from.
    IIRC, he (Graner, who was involved in Abu Ghraib, not the SEALs incident) is doing time in Leavenworth. Personally, I'd rather see Rumsfeld pay a visit to the gallows.
    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    Downstreet on the flip-flop, timepants.
  7. vigilus is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/08/2010 3:41pm


     Style: Yoshinkan Aikido, MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thread drift
    I won't let my guys bring cameras on patrols overseas, exercises or even mess functions.

    I'm not trying to hide war crimes or anything but it seems like when cameras are around people go out of their way to do stupid ****-and then post it on youtube and facebook.
    You are not free whose liberty is won by the rigour of other, more righteous souls. Your are merely protected. Your freedom is parasitic, you suck the honourable man dry and offer nothing in return. You who have enjoyed freedom, who have done nothing to earn it
  8. TheRuss is offline
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    is badder than you

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    Posted On:
    5/08/2010 5:27pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by GuiltySpark View Post
    Thread drift
    I won't let my guys bring cameras on patrols overseas, exercises or even mess functions.

    I'm not trying to hide war crimes or anything but it seems like when cameras are around people go out of their way to do stupid ****-and then post it on youtube and facebook.
    The "combat cams", for lack of a better term, can be useful to provide evidence in support of decisions made.

    Of course, every so often, they reveal that you made the biggest mistake of your life...
    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    Downstreet on the flip-flop, timepants.
  9. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/08/2010 5:38pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    No, there is a difference between "combat cams" and the idiots that just snap random pictures. That's what GS is talking about IMO.
  10. TheRuss is offline
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    Posted On:
    5/08/2010 5:44pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    No, there is a difference between "combat cams" and the idiots that just snap random pictures. That's what GS is talking about IMO.
    Yeah, I get that. In the context of Abu Ghraib, though, the two overlap.

    One of the counts that Lynndie England pleaded guilty to was conspiring to mistreat detainees. Now, as the judge said, a conspiracy requires at least two people. And when Graner took the stand, he said that he was not intending to abuse detainees. He said that when he put that leash -- he called it a tether -- around the naked detainees' neck and asked England to pose for a photograph with him, he thought he was documenting a legitimate use of force.
    - http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/milit...land_5-04.html (emphasis mine)

    Idiots with cameras is more this kind of thing (depending on who you believe).
    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    Downstreet on the flip-flop, timepants.
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