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  1. marcusdbrutus is offline
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    Senior Member

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    Posted On:
    12/07/2009 4:20pm


     Style: MT, Judo & BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Raging Monkey View Post
    No, what I meant was gravity adds the same force to a downward elbow when you are on top as it does to a horizontal elbow.

    The point being if gravity is the reason something is illegal than *any* punch/elbow from the top position would also be illegal for the same reason not just a downward elbow.
    If you were WATCHING the fight, Rogan actually explained the reason it's illegal. Apparently one of the commissioners saw some Karate demo where someone broke through a shitload of ice with that elbow, so they decided it was too dangerous. Not even kidding...

    He also said its retarded, but that's the reason and those are the rules.
  2. Hesperus is offline
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    it's all vanity

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    Posted On:
    12/07/2009 4:31pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kano-Gracie

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yeah, I don't believe that last bit for a second.

    And gravity isn't the reason headstomps are not legal and upkicks are. This really isn't that hard.
  3. Fighting Cephalopod is offline
    Fighting Cephalopod's Avatar

    Submitting 1d6 Investigators per round

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    Posted On:
    12/07/2009 5:12pm

    supporting member
     Style: ZHOO ZHITSU

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Hesperus View Post
    Yeah, I don't believe that last bit for a second.
    You can believe whatever you like, but it's 100% true. Big John has confirmed this in interviews.

    As for Houston/Kimbo - people are far too quick to call work on things that are easily explained as Bad Fighters Fighting Badly.
    Undisputed KING OF ASSHOLES.
  4. galois is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/07/2009 5:28pm


     Style: MT and judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Raging Monkey View Post
    You mean the same gravity that adds the same force to elbows from any angle?
    I'm not trying to explain or defend the rule, I'm primarily responding to the part where you said "where the fucking ceiling is has no bearing on anything in the real world", which is not true. Gravity makes a huge difference to striking power. Also, striking with the point of the elbow is different from striking with a fist. On top of this, striking something which is braced against solid resistance from the opposite direction, such as the floor, makes a big difference. Again, I'm not saying the rules are consistent, or even that this is the reason why the rules are in place but there it is.
  5. JudOWNED is offline
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    北斗十字固拳

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    Posted On:
    12/07/2009 6:14pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Gravity makes a huge difference to striking power.
    Source? Seriously, I think this is one of those things that SOUNDS like common sense, but really isn't. We're talking such small objects traveling such a short space, I doubt gravity has any bearing at all. I mean, it's not like we're talking about doing some pro wrestling elbow drop off the turnbuckle.
  6. Suprore is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/07/2009 6:34pm


     Style: Bjj

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    We are however talking about putting your whole upper body into a downward's swing ending at a point, i cannot imagine gravity does not come into play.
  7. galois is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/07/2009 6:40pm


     Style: MT and judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by JuHo Ho HOWNED View Post
    Source? Seriously, I think this is one of those things that SOUNDS like common sense, but really isn't. We're talking such small objects traveling such a short space, I doubt gravity has any bearing at all. I mean, it's not like we're talking about doing some pro wrestling elbow drop off the turnbuckle.
    Hmmm. You may have a point. I imagined it would make a difference in the same way getting your weight behind a punch makes a difference. I guess it depends on whether the acceleration due to gravity is great enough to make a difference over the distances involved. My experience of heavy weights falling very short distances onto me and hurting like motherfuckers makes me think it probably is, but this may not translate into a fighting context where it is more difficult to harness the body's weight. I would guess that for some strikes it would play a greater role than others.
  8. SifuJason is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/07/2009 6:43pm


     Style: WHKD (Kaju), Sub. Grapple

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It's not gravity that important, so much as it is the ability to really use your hips to power the strike. You can do it from the top, but not so easily from the bottom.
  9. Wolf is offline
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    T3h R34l Gangnam Style!

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    Posted On:
    12/07/2009 7:24pm

    staff
     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Raging Monkey View Post
    No, what I meant was gravity adds the same force to a downward elbow when you are on top as it does to a horizontal elbow.

    The point being if gravity is the reason something is illegal than *any* punch/elbow from the top position would also be illegal for the same reason not just a downward elbow.
    ah, i think i see the confusion. I thought by horizontal elbow you were talking about those moving in a horizontal manner, not the elbow held differently. You're saying the person is still on top and striking up and down, but using the front of the elbow (which is legal) instead of point as in a "downward spiking elbow?" Am I correct in what you're saying? If so I agree.
  10. Ming Loyalist is offline
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    solves problems with violence

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    Posted On:
    12/07/2009 7:46pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, Hung Family Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by sleigher View Post
    striking something which is braced against solid resistance from the opposite direction, such as the floor, makes a big difference.
    this is the fucking truth. there's a world of difference getting kicked in the face the with heel while standing, and getting stomped with the heel when your head is on the ground. i can personally attest to this.

    the first hurt like a ************.

    the second hurt *so* bad, i never want to be hit that hard again. ever. and it took me close to a year to be able to spar hard, even with headgear so that the fracture could heal.
    "Face punches are an essential character building part of a martial art. You don't truly love your children unless you allow them to get punched in the face." - chi-conspiricy
    "When I was a little boy, I had a sailor suit, but it didn't mean I was in the Navy." - Mtripp on the subject of a 5 year old karate black belt
    "Without actual qualifications to be a Zen teacher, your instructor is just another roundeye raping Asian culture for a buck." - Errant108
    "Seriously, who gives a **** what you or Errant think? You're Asian males, everyone just ignores you, unless you're in a krotty movie." - new2bjj

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