10/29/2009 11:47am, #31
Seriously, why did you have to go there?
That's low, dude.
10/29/2009 5:22pm, #32
What Der wants to say is that throws who are not in the official Judo sylabus of the Kodokan, but are added to it because they follow the same "filosofie/style" as Kodokan Judo get their name/classification from the mother style from which they were important.
In Japan and Europe the throw is Te Guruma
In Korea it's Duromechigi
In the USA it's a Duck under
In Russia...I don't know how it's called, but you get the point.
Since we are now discussing Yudo, it's Duromechigi.
In Europe, Japan and the USA it would be Te Guruma, because the USA and Europe take the Japanese names over. Unless the Judo clubs only follow the Kodokan sylabus and there are (ex)-wrestlers training, then it will be a Duck under.
In Russia....still don't know the Russian name, but again you get the point.Originally Posted by Jiujitsu77Originally Posted by HumanzeeOriginally Posted by jk55299 on Keysi Fighting Method
10/29/2009 10:56pm, #33
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That's all very interesting, but it kinda misses the point.
The video says "this technique is a unique Korean technique", which is what people are taking issue with, because it clearly isn't.
Ergo, the video is full of fucking ****.
10/30/2009 4:53am, #34
Te Guruma is not a part of the official Judo sylabus. (so we aren't sure that it was ever taught in Judo classes).
Duromechigi is taken from Ssireum, so from the Korean point of view the technique is uniquelly Korean. (it's all in point of views and schematics).Originally Posted by Jiujitsu77Originally Posted by HumanzeeOriginally Posted by jk55299 on Keysi Fighting Method
10/30/2009 6:00am, #35
10/30/2009 8:01am, #36
Sigh Te guruma is not listed as one of the official 67. Its is instead called sukui nage for official purposes. That particular variation is called te guruma and is in Mifune's book.
I am not going to get into these senseless discussions anymore about what is or isn't Judo and who started it or were it came from or what variation was started were. Its stupid and senseless. If a country who has had its ass handed to it for centuries wants to claim they invented something then by all means go ahead. If a bunch of asianophiles want to be on that bandwagon then go ahead. I for one will just keep dumping motherfuckers on their skulls and calling it Judo. If anyone asks were I learned it I will tell them from an alligator in the swamp. Since they have been around since the prehistoric era they should know more about grappling than anyone.Judo is only gentle for the guy on top.
10/30/2009 8:31am, #37
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Let's say in USA, if Judoka joins wrestling team and does Kata Guruma and Morote-gari or version of sukui-nage. In reverse situation, a wrestler joins Judo team and does fireman's carry or double/single leg. Does it matter that much what it's called or who invented it.
While I don't agree that the throw in question is uniquely Korean in technique. I don't think anything is wrong with calling it Korean name. As for claiming to have invented something unique. I agree that's pretty dumb. That said same can be applied to any grappling technique. Except that Korea is sore from being ass handed to them for centuries while USA and Japan aren't since we're victors on most cases.
10/30/2009 10:02am, #38
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I see nothing in the execution of the technique Duromechigi that would make it korean. It's done exactly in the same fashion as Te-Guruma. Samboists usually do throws would probably classify as one of the 67 gokyo throws listed, but they usually add a variation of it making the throw itself unique example Uranage.
Sambo Uranage at the 0;04 mark
YouTube - Sambo
10/30/2009 10:21am, #39
10/30/2009 11:30am, #40
Don't wax semantically with me. I ain't in the mood for that enlightened nonsensical bullshit. Go talk in circles with someone else.Judo is only gentle for the guy on top.