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  1. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/14/2009 8:23am

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Red Staff View Post
    It looks like I can be personally attacked here but when I answer it my posts are moved somewhere. I should have known that would happen here.
    Then respond to the personal attacks. I informed you of the rules of this forum. You response to a so called personal attack is to bring up "Mad Dog Soard?"

    Address the points, address the personal opinions, leave the trolling in another forum or start your own thread.

    This was moved to MABS because, you didn't believe there were other cases. There are three police reports and a news article detailing the plaintiffs versions.

    When what you asked for was provided, you went into troll mode with the "Mad dog Soard" comments. Your original posts, which shouldn't be left here, are still here for context. Some of the idiocy from everyone is still here for context. After the rule post anyone off-topic will have their post removed.

    Don't like it don't post.



    No matter, Many of us knows what the future holds for the instructors of the nine schools. May they may fun with their independent schools!
    You hope.
  2. Matt Phillips is online now
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    NOTE TO SELF - MOAR GRAPPLE - GET A NORMAL HAIR CUT - REPEAT

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    Posted On:
    10/14/2009 9:02am

    supporting member
     Style: Submission Grappling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What is the point of having a cult if you can't take sexual advantage of the followers? That's a good bit of the point of having a cult. Show me a cult that doesn't have this component, and I'll show you a suicide cult.
    Now darkness comes; you don't know if the whales are coming. - Royce Gracie


    KosherKickboxer has t3h r34l chi sao

    In De Janerio, in blackest night,
    Luta Livre flees the fight,
    Behold Maeda's sacred tights;
    Beware my power... Blue Lantern's light!
  3. krsd is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/14/2009 6:08pm


     Style: Kungfu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Red Staff View Post
    No matter, Many of us knows what the future holds for the instructors of the nine schools. May they may fun with their independent schools!
    Actually it looks like the nine schools are doing and going to do pretty well on their own. So here is a break down of the schools to list it out cleanly.

    CSC's still affiliated with the Soards:

    • Colorado
      • Boulder
      • Denver
      • Colorado Springs

    • Arizona
      • Phoenix (kind of ~ more on this to follow)


      • Tucson

    • California
      • Los Angeles

    • New Mexico
      • Albuquerque

    • Utah
      • Salt Lake City

    • Ireland
      • Cork


    CSC's no longer affiliated with the Soards (aka Break away Schools):

    • Arizona
      • ASU Rec Club
      • Phoenix/Tempe

    • California
      • San Jose

    • Idaho
      • Boise
      • Cadwell
      • Emmett

    • Nevada
      • LasVegas

    • New York
      • New York City

    • Oregon

      • Portland

    • Washington
      • Seattle


    The Boulder CU Rec Club was dissolved as it's instructor was one of the plaintiffs against David Soard. From my understanding she was kicked out of the art, and a complaint was sent to the university saying that she was no longer authorized to teach and was in violation of copyright.

    The Phoenix AZ school that is associated with the Soards is a new "replacement school." The Soards sent an instructor to Phoenix to start this school and compete with the existing school (also one of the plaintiffs against David Soard). Interestingly the Chinese Shaolin Center existing school had gone about becoming a official business prior to these events (in 2001 in fact), so is licensed by the Arizona Corporation Commission to operate using the name "Chinese Shaolin Center" legally.

    http://starpas.azcc.gov/scripts/cgiip.exe/WService=wsbroker1/names-detail.p?name-id=L09903155&type=L.L.C.


    As a result the "replacement school" is going under the name of "Chinese Shao-lin Kung Fu". This and "Chinese Shao-lin Center Phoenix" have been registered as Trade Names with the Arizona Secretary of State.

    http://www.azsos.gov/scripts/TnT_Search_Engine.dll/ZoomAGT?AGENT_ID=949697


    The "replacement school" also claims to have information about "ASU Shao-lin Kung Fu" coming soon, which is probably news to the club president; a 3rd black that runs the current program and regularly attends the existing CSC school.

    Note: I am aware that while we have been referring to nine break away schools I have listed out ten here. The tenth is the ASU Rec Club which was not listed separately on the dissacociation letter since it has been overseen by the current Phoenix instructors while the actual club president has changed as students move through the school.
    Last edited by krsd; 10/14/2009 6:52pm at .
  4. krsd is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/15/2009 12:13pm


     Style: Kungfu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I talked to the ASU Club President last night and got a update as to their status. It looks like they stopped being an official ASU club this semester due to scheduling issues for space on campus, and additional liability insurance requirements that ASU wanted to place on them. As a result it is now more of a special program offered to ASU students, and their classes are mixed in at the regular CSC location.
  5. krsd is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/15/2009 3:36pm


     Style: Kungfu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The following was released this morning to the Phoenix CSC students (I have removed font colors to make it more legible on this site):

    ---------------------------
    Hello again Shaolin,

    We have recently formed more friendships within our Shaolin System. The newest Shaolin schools in our network are in Georgia and Tennessee. The schools in Georgia are headed by Senior Master Gary Grooms and Master Michael Reid. The schools in Tennessee are headed by Elder Master Garry Mullins. Please feel free to visit their below websites for more information and a list of their schools:

    www.ShaolinCenter.com
    www.Mullins-Shaolin.com

    All students are more than welcome to travel to, visit, and train at these schools or attend seminars they may be holding. Their students are also more than welcome in Phoenix, Arizona. Please let us know in Phoenix before you do attend any out of state classes so we can tell them you are coming! These newest Masters do not own our school but have been great supporters of ours as we will be of theirs. We look forward to training with them and getting to know them and their students in the years ahead.

    Elder Master Mullins and family, and Senior Master Grooms and family, and possibly Master Matt Small, Master John Keller, Joe Weiland, Thad Wong, etc. will be coming to Phoenix over the November 5th, 6th, 7th, and 8th (Thursday - Sunday) week and weekend. I would love to have everyone in classes that Thursday and Saturday to meet our newest Shaolin friends! Don't miss these dates!

    Below is the new announcement and CSC History that will be displayed on our website very soon!

    Much success and excitement in your training ahead,

    Jake Rydberg






    CSC History

    The CSC Phoenix was founded in 1991 and is in its 18th year, now located in Tempe, Arizona. The head instructors / owners of the Phoenix CSC are 3rd Degree Black Belt Jacob Rydberg and 2nd Degree Black Belt Laura Adams. While continuing to teach and pass down the Shaolin art to new enthusiastic Shaolin, Laura and Jacob are current students themselves constantly training and advancing in the Shaolin art. They also enjoy training and visiting with other great Shaolin Masters and Masters of the Martial Arts. Please check the school nearest you, whether New York, Idaho, Las Vegas, Portland, Seattle, San Jose', Georgia, and Tennessee.


    Our Shaolin network is very strong and supportive. We honor our current collection of friendly instructors and schools including our newest martial arts relationships with Elder Master Gary Mullins in Tennessee and Senior Master Gary Grooms in Georgia. We are looking forward to the training and experiences that we as well as our students will have available with Master Mullins and Master Grooms in the years ahead. Thank you to Elder Master Mullins, Senior Master Grooms, and their students and instructors for being true examples of Shaolin -- skillful in external and internal kung fu as well as having a strong martial arts code of ethics.

    This year, 2009, is truly a year to reflect on the Phoenix. Not only is it the name of our wonderful city but it reminds us to embrace and enjoy the change that the great Phoenix bird represents. This year has been a year of rebirth. We are constantly enhancing the experience at the Chinese Shao-Lin Center in Phoenix to maintain the wonderful support of our great students. We have an enlightening and electric school because of you all, the students!

    The Instructors and Students at our school are preparing for the upcoming 2011 China Trip, visiting even more unique, historic and remote locations than any trip prior! Come join us!

    Sincerely,

    Laura Adams and Jacob Rydberg
  6. Mace Maniac is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/16/2009 3:03am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Interesting Link Just Found

  7. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/16/2009 9:51am

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If this can be confirmed wow.

    IMO No. He could handle it better and most of the animosity would be gone. He goes where the money flows IMO.
    9 viable schools that make money vs 2-3 rogues? Not even close. Copyright IMO is a way to scare people into opting out. If you aren't financially secure, like the Soards, then you can't handle a frivolous lawsuit. So, most fade away and are quiet.
    Exactly what I thought would happen. He still gets profit from all of the schools.
  8. krsd is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/16/2009 12:02pm


     Style: Kungfu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    If this can be confirmed wow.
    I can confirm the letter in that I have a copy of that same letter, both physical and digital. I was planning to post it this morning, but it looks like someone beat me to it. :tongue8:

    I however did note that while this may address the "authorization" of the break away schools and their disassociation from David Soard to some extent it does not address several other pretty important issues:

    • What is the status of the plaintiffs against David Soard that were "kicked out" of the art that were not school instructors?
    • What about territory protection? Normally the schools under Sin The' are afforded this sort of protection in that Sin The won't authorize a new school in the same area as an existing school without the existing instructors agreement. In the case of Phoenix this is already being violated at this time.
    • This does not in any way address the issue of David Soard and the charges brought against him.
    • This does not in any way address the related issue of David and Sharron Soards behavior in trying to defame those who stood against them, of harassing and trying to intimidate the plaintiffs in the case, those who testified, and any who openly stood with them.
    • This also does not address the repeated nature of these sorts of issues arising from the Soards, and the repeated attempts to gloss over it (a.k.a. Sweep it under the rug and "move on").
    • There are of course other issues not addressed beyond this list.

    I realize that legally he does not have to take a stance on a lot of this, but ethically from someone who is the Grandmaster of "Shaolin" I would think that it would be expected that he both be held to and hold those teaching in his name to a higher standard.

    There is of course a relationship that has developed between him and the Soards, and with that no doubt comes a level or respect and trust. However the position of teacher is one of stewardship, where the teacher is entrusted with the care of their students. While the students involved may not be regular students of Sin The's, every one of them has trained under him. He entrusted David Soard with their regular training, and that trust in my opinion has been sorely abused. I would think that Sin The's responsibilities to his students would require that he take a more active stance.

    Of course that would be assuming that this was looked at with a mind towards the ethics of the situation bearing more weight than the financial.
    Last edited by krsd; 10/16/2009 12:30pm at .
  9. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/16/2009 12:34pm

    staff
     Style: xingyi

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    All valid questions but, I'll take a wait and see attitude.
  10. Shaolin Girl is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/16/2009 3:16pm


     Style: Traditional Kung Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by krsd View Post
    Of course that would be assuming that this was looked at with a mind towards the ethics of the situation bearing more weight than the financial.
    It seems Sin Thé doesn't have to do a damn thing at this stage: He played the situation well and ended up with all the loot, although whether it's as much as before remains to be seen. In any case, my opinion of the man is so low that if I told you what I really thought of him, I'd probably get attacked by his groupies.

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