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  1. LarsCG is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/05/2009 5:57am


     Style: Judo/Roadwork

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Offtopic, but the topic of this thread made me think of Paul McKenna doing BJJ...

    *snaps fingers* "...And you're under. Now, when I snap my fingers again you will be wide awake and we will start to roll, but any time I mention an Italian dish you will tap." *snaps fingers*

    "Ok, let's roll. You should have an easy time today, I feel as solid as a bowl of spaghetti."

    *tap*
  2. Sri Hanuman is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/05/2009 6:59am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Cheng Man Ching Taijiquan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Interesting enough...
    CK, PM me, I can forward you the few tracks I... er... ahem.... bought.

    We can try this as an experiment, but we need a control group. Any ideas?
    =================
    Kama Sutra blue belt.

    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    I used to **** guys like you in prison.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rock Ape View Post
    Dude I kill people for a fucking living.

    Dipshit
  3. Sri Hanuman is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/05/2009 7:20am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Cheng Man Ching Taijiquan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by vinhthekid View Post
    if anyone wants to paypal me half... i'll pay for the other half out of pocket.
    PM me, we can work this out.
    Need to think of a way to turn this into an experiment proper.

    Let's see if we can get some scienticians in on this.
    =================
    Kama Sutra blue belt.

    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    I used to **** guys like you in prison.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rock Ape View Post
    Dude I kill people for a fucking living.

    Dipshit
  4. galois is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/05/2009 9:18am


     Style: MT and judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Here are my thoughts if anyone is interested, with the caveat that I'm not an experimental scientist so my opinion is really no more valid on this subject than anyone else's.

    Firstly I think setting up the experiment it will be very difficult for various reasons I will list below:

    1) Getting enough numbers involved of comparable skill levels to form control and test groups will be almost impossible. There's also a sub problem of dividing the groups appropriately; if your control is all brown belts and your test group is made up of three week noobs then of course the test group will improve faster. This can be got around but it would involve a severely weakening judgement call on what constituted two 'equivalent' groups (does two blues belts and a purple belt equal two white belts and a brown belt?).

    2) There is no true 'control' as almost everyone will be training with differing intesity at different clubs anyway.

    3) How will success be measured? Various claims are made by the product which could either be seperated out and tested individually or absorbed into the grand claim of "making you better at jj".

    If you choose to test the individual claims then those relating to physical attributes are both the most unlikely and the easiest to test, relatively speaking, IF you can get everyone in both groups to follow the same PT program for a given period of time and IF you can regulate the groups by current PT standards. There are also several claims made about mental enhancement. These would be more difficult to test; you'd need someone with a psychology background or similar and I imagine the experiments required would be difficult to set up.

    If you choose to test the end jj improvement I imagine the best way would be some kind of questionaire or sequence of questionaires. Again you'd need someone with a psychology background, and ideally a solid jj background, to write these.
    If you chose to test both the individual claims and the grand claim this would further complicate things by broadening the constraints on the groupings to encompass those of jj and of the individual claims.

    4) How will results be gathered and regulated? This is a problem for all experiments of this kind but here the difficulty is compounded by the internet factor. Obviously whatever results are gathered will never be scientifically valid but even to approach anecdotal plausibility will be difficult.
     

    With these problems in mind my opinion is that the best way to conduct the experiment would be to abandon a half hearted attempt at scientific validity and go for a more informal approach. Get everyone involved to give a short write up of their experience with the product, giving relevant information such as how they used it, level in jj when starting the experiment, their traning program etc. and ending with a section on whether and how they feel the product has helped them. Obviously this is far from journal worthy but it is at least honest and, maybe, informative. At the very least anyone interested will be able to look at these testimonies and make their own minds up.

    Anway, those were my 2 cents. I'm sure I've missed some points and am wrong about others but I hope it's helpful none the less.

    p.s. here I'm restricting the product to jj, bjj specifically. From the blurb alone I see no reason for this restriction. On the other hand, encompassing other arts, while making finding sufficient numbers easier, would increase the difficulties in other areas of a formal experiment. It would obviously make no difference to my suggested method.
    Last edited by galois; 10/05/2009 9:23am at .
  5. Coach Josh is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/05/2009 9:49am

    Business Class Supporting Member
     Gladiators Academy Lafayette, LA Style: Judo, MMA, White Trash JJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Can't speak for what the advertising is selling but I can speak on martial arts training with some knowledge.

    The mental aspects of training are not for the beginner. It's the physical aspects of training that you are learning to over come. Testing the limits of your body and pushing them beyond what you think you can do. After you develop a physical body that can stand the rigors of training the mental aspects of training can truly begin.

    This is no secret or hidden technique but a time tested fully functioning practice that takes place everyday in the US military. Those who went to boot camp will understand those who don't go watch Full Metal Jacket.

    Mentally preparing yourself for a match is paramount in your training at higher levels. The ability to shut out the world and focus on the task at hand is the hallmark of a true martial artist or professional fighter.

    The methods that many people use are varied far and wide. Some listen to music, some like to meditate, and some have a ritualistic way of getting dressed. Regardless of what they do or how they do it they have a method.

    Meditation has been touted for years by the TMA. It has its benefits and its purpose in training. Because most of us live in fast paced society and we are rushing from here to there with bills to pay, kids to feed, classes to teach and 20 other things to do in a day our minds are a swirling mess.

    Because we do not know how to slow our minds down and focus at first it is justifiable to seek instruction in the area. After learning methods and techniques you can then begin to practice and find your method for concentration. It's no different than learning to do an arm bar or choke.

    My time is in the shower. In the morning I put the water on scolding hot and stand there straightening out my day. I think of the things I am going to teach in my classroom that day and of the things that I am going to teach at the gym. I will place them in order in my mind and replay it to get it straight. I will also think of something to improve on that day. Be it as a teacher or in my training. Right now its my guard work.

    After working out at the gym I shower again and relive my day and my training and look to see if I did better.

    I am married with 2 kids and 2 jobs so that is the only time I have to myself.
    Judo is only gentle for the guy on top.
  6. Sri Hanuman is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/05/2009 10:21am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Cheng Man Ching Taijiquan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    All good points.

    I'm still curious however, to see if it makes any kind of difference in training, be it purely attitude-wise, or something entirely different. Since it's something that piqued my curiosity, I decided to jump the gun, and get my hands on a copy.

    Like Galois suggested, I'm going to focus on 3 specific claims made by the product:

    >Improve your concentration and focus - stay sharp in sparring or a fight!
    >remove any limiting barriers to your success (in my case, apprehension when it comes to going in for takedowns, plus, hesitation during sidemount is a real bitch)
    >fight "in the moment" - without worry or FEAR!

    Will see if there is any difference within a 3 week period by keeping a daily journal and noting daily practice and behavior related to training. If any other guienna pigs... er... ahem... bullies are curious to join in, PM me.
    =================
    Kama Sutra blue belt.

    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    I used to **** guys like you in prison.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rock Ape View Post
    Dude I kill people for a fucking living.

    Dipshit
  7. Conde Koma is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/05/2009 12:29pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo,MT,Boxing,BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Perhaps we can create a control group by using another wave track, one without the subliminal messages? Give half the subliminal messages, the other half just the wave sounds, and see what happens. No one knows but you who got which, so we can see if the subliminal messages had any more effect than the regular wave track, or if both work, we can say it was a placebo effect.
  8. Sri Hanuman is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/05/2009 12:49pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Cheng Man Ching Taijiquan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Conde Koma View Post
    Perhaps we can create a control group by using another wave track, one without the subliminal messages? Give half the subliminal messages, the other half just the wave sounds, and see what happens. No one knows but you who got which, so we can see if the subliminal messages had any more effect than the regular wave track, or if both work, we can say it was a placebo effect.
    Good thinking.
    Now if we can get enough interested people involved, we're in business.
    =================
    Kama Sutra blue belt.

    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    I used to **** guys like you in prison.
    Quote Originally Posted by Rock Ape View Post
    Dude I kill people for a fucking living.

    Dipshit
  9. maofas is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/05/2009 1:19pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kenkojuku Karate, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Conde Koma View Post
    But with the rising levels of mercury in our seafood, wouldn't the harms outweigh the benefits of eating more fish?
    Not all fish is contaminated with mercury I believe, but those found in the Great Lakes certainly are. You can buy Fish Oil capsules that have been distilled and have almost 0% mercury in them too.

    I'm really not into supplements, but I'm a real believer in Fish Oil. That + multivitamins are all I take.
  10. Conde Koma is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/05/2009 1:35pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo,MT,Boxing,BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It depends on the kind of fish, as mercury is a bio accumulative, meaning that fish higher on the food chain (tuna, salmon, other tasty ones) have lots more mercury than smaller fish (sardines and such). Actually, sardines are supposed to be a really good fish to eat because of their high oil content, as opposed to the more popular tuna, which has some ridiculous amount of mercury and other metals.
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