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  1. Jim_Jude is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/29/2009 8:45pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: StrikeyGrappling & WW2-fu

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    Sosa family teaching Koga ryu in CA?

    I was down at Ken's Trading in Rancho Cucamonga and a little Mexican guy came in wearing gi pants with ankle wraps and tabi. I asked the guy handling my order if he was a gardener or something (^_^) and he replied "Oh, no. He's a ninja." Insert sarcasm.
    I talk to the guy and he gives me his business card:

    Jorge Sosa Jr
    Menkyo, 9th Dan Karatedo
    Shito-Ryu Sosa-Kai
    World Union Budo Sosa-Kai
    22790 Wimpole St
    Moreno Valley CA 92553
    (951) 653 5648
    BudoSosaKai@yahoo.com
    http://www.shitoryusosakai.net

    So... anyways, he told me that in addition to Shito Ryu he also practiced Koga Ryu Ninjutsu from Fujita Seiko and Kenei Mabuni (?). I can't read most of the Spanish on the sight, does anyone know if this Kenei Mabuni and thus the Sosa family could be a legitimate source for Koga Ryu? Thanks.
    "Judo is a study of techniques with which you may kill if you wish to kill, injure if you wish to injure, subdue if you wish to subdue, and, when attacked, defend yourself" - Jigoro Kano (1889)
    ***Was this quote "taken out of context"?***

    "The judoist has no time to allow himself a margin for error, especially in a situation upon which his or another person's very life depends...."
    ~ The Secret of Judo (Jiichi Watanabe & Lindy Avakian), p.19

    "Hope is not a method... nor is enthusiasm."
    ~ Brigadier General Gordon Toney
  2. Conde Koma is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/30/2009 12:58am

    supporting member
     Style: Judo,MT,Boxing,BJJ

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    According to Plasma, Kawakami said that there are no teachers of Koga-ryu in the US at all. Not sure about Hispanic-Americans, but there was mention of a Juan Hombre who claims lineage, "but he only trained with them several times, he is not a deshi [student], and does not have a certificate to teach."

    Koka-ryu Ninjutsu At Drew University - No BS MMA and Martial Arts
    Last edited by Conde Koma; 9/30/2009 12:58am at . Reason: typo
  3. Jim_Jude is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/30/2009 1:32am

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     Style: StrikeyGrappling & WW2-fu

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    Quote Originally Posted by Conde Koma View Post
    According to Plasma, Kawakami said that there are no teachers of Koga-ryu in the US at all. Not sure about Hispanic-Americans, but there was mention of a Juan Hombre who claims lineage, "but he only trained with them several times, he is not a deshi [student], and does not have a certificate to teach."

    Koka-ryu Ninjutsu At Drew University - No BS MMA and Martial Arts
    These guys claim lineage through this shito ryu guy Kenei Mabuni, not directly from Fujita Seiko. Who knows? One ninjer saying that there are no other ninjaz around? Isn't that the Ninjer Code?
    "Judo is a study of techniques with which you may kill if you wish to kill, injure if you wish to injure, subdue if you wish to subdue, and, when attacked, defend yourself" - Jigoro Kano (1889)
    ***Was this quote "taken out of context"?***

    "The judoist has no time to allow himself a margin for error, especially in a situation upon which his or another person's very life depends...."
    ~ The Secret of Judo (Jiichi Watanabe & Lindy Avakian), p.19

    "Hope is not a method... nor is enthusiasm."
    ~ Brigadier General Gordon Toney
  4. Goju - Joe is offline
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    I am a Ninja bitches!! Deal with it

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    Posted On:
    9/30/2009 4:20am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Improv comedy

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    Beware he could be Kaiser Sosa - you don't want to mess with him
  5. Styygens is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/30/2009 8:18pm


     Style: BBT/BJJ/CJKD

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    I was going to post from memory, but I'm glad I waited to check my sources...

    The best existing source in English on the details of Fujita Seiko's life is Fujita Seiko: The Last Koga Ninja, by Phillip T. Hevener. It's available on Amazon, and if you have a burning desire to get into the details I don't cover here, I recommend it.

    The whole thrust of the book is that Fujita Seiko said himself that he did not pass on his Wada-ha lineage of Koga Ryu Ninjutsu. The book also examines whether or not there is evidence to the contrary. It shows he had several opportunities to pass the lineage, but nothing indicates he did. Any other book I have mentioning Fujita Seiko says the same thing: he was the last of his line.

    As an aside, the current issue over Kawakami's claim to Koga Ryu appears to involve a different branch of the Ryu unrelated to Wada-Ha Koga Ryu.

    However, the story you present has some interesting and possibly legitimate connections to Fujita Seiko.

    Mabuni Kenwa, founder of Shito Ryu Karate was friendly with Fujita Seiko. He recommended one of his top students, Iwata Manzo, train with Fujita Seiko.

    Fujita was not only a ninjutsu practitioner, but held the position of headmaster in three other martial arts: Nanban Satto Ryu Kempo, Shingetsu-Ryu shurikenjutsu, and Daien-ryu jojutsu. None of these were related to Koga Ryu Ninjutsu. Iwata Manzo became Hanshi of Shito Ryu Karate, but he also inherited the headmastership of all three of Fujita's bujutsu (and non-ninjutsu) ryu.

    This has caused some speculation that Iwata Manzo secretly inherited Wada-Ha Koga Ryu. However, he never claimed this, and it goes against Fujita's own declaration that ninjutsu would die with him. No one has presented any serious, independent evidence that Iwata Manzo inherited anything in secret.

    That's the story as I know it. There is a connection between Shito Ryu and Fujita Seiko. I can't say whether or not Shito Ryu continues to pass along any of the techniques from Nanban Setto Ryu, Shingetsu Ryu, or Daien Ryu, but maybe some branch does. But even then, it's not Koga Ryu Ninjutsu.

    I also don't know if Shito Ryu hands out Menkyo or 9th dans; especially to people who think it makes them ninja... That alone might make this guy MABS worthy...
  6. Jim_Jude is offline
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    Posted On:
    9/30/2009 9:21pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: StrikeyGrappling & WW2-fu

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    Thanks guys! lots of info & I've been out of the Ninjer loop for awhile... which brings up another point: if a MOD thinks this should be in another forum, pls move it, I won't be offended. It just seemed there were too many links to legitimate ryuha to put it anywhere else for quick verification.
    "Judo is a study of techniques with which you may kill if you wish to kill, injure if you wish to injure, subdue if you wish to subdue, and, when attacked, defend yourself" - Jigoro Kano (1889)
    ***Was this quote "taken out of context"?***

    "The judoist has no time to allow himself a margin for error, especially in a situation upon which his or another person's very life depends...."
    ~ The Secret of Judo (Jiichi Watanabe & Lindy Avakian), p.19

    "Hope is not a method... nor is enthusiasm."
    ~ Brigadier General Gordon Toney
  7. skythere is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/05/2009 10:14pm


     

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    Cheers!
    Valikie
    Out of the many posts, this one attract my attention. I believe it is possible for anyone to participate.
    Excellent ! I like it very much.
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  8. Jim_Jude is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/06/2009 2:46pm

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     Style: StrikeyGrappling & WW2-fu

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    Quote Originally Posted by skythere View Post
    Cheers!
    Valikie
    Out of the many posts, this one attract my attention. I believe it is possible for anyone to participate.
    Excellent ! I like it very much.
    __________________
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    What?
    "Judo is a study of techniques with which you may kill if you wish to kill, injure if you wish to injure, subdue if you wish to subdue, and, when attacked, defend yourself" - Jigoro Kano (1889)
    ***Was this quote "taken out of context"?***

    "The judoist has no time to allow himself a margin for error, especially in a situation upon which his or another person's very life depends...."
    ~ The Secret of Judo (Jiichi Watanabe & Lindy Avakian), p.19

    "Hope is not a method... nor is enthusiasm."
    ~ Brigadier General Gordon Toney
  9. Yoj is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/06/2009 2:50pm


     Style: Aikijujutsu

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    He said "read my spamming sites"
  10. Jim_Jude is offline
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    Posted On:
    10/06/2009 2:55pm

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     Style: StrikeyGrappling & WW2-fu

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    Quote Originally Posted by Yoj View Post
    He said "read my spamming sites"
    Oh. Figures. Mods: check this guy out? Thanx!
    "Judo is a study of techniques with which you may kill if you wish to kill, injure if you wish to injure, subdue if you wish to subdue, and, when attacked, defend yourself" - Jigoro Kano (1889)
    ***Was this quote "taken out of context"?***

    "The judoist has no time to allow himself a margin for error, especially in a situation upon which his or another person's very life depends...."
    ~ The Secret of Judo (Jiichi Watanabe & Lindy Avakian), p.19

    "Hope is not a method... nor is enthusiasm."
    ~ Brigadier General Gordon Toney
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