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  1. [Tycho?] is offline

    Featherweight

    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Posts
    34

    Posted On:
    8/24/2009 9:46pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    As has been stated already, particularly by Naszir but by others too, is that diversification is key. I have several separate points, but they all boil down to diversification.

    Getting judoka to compete in a variety of grappling competitions is an excellent idea. It widens the skill set and makes the art more generally applicable. I think this is very much in line with judo as it was initially founded; jujitsu boiled down to what was effective, not as a sport which serves only itself.

    Judo is so similar to both BJJ and sambo that the transition can be made easily. I've read that top sambo guys started coming to Japan to win judo tournaments; in return, judo guys went to Russia to prepare for the sambo, and ended up winning some of their tournaments. New challenges improve everyone; isolation encourages only stagnation.

    Appeal to MMA.
    Train no-gi. I would adore no-gi judo, I think throws are extremely cool compared to wrestling style takedowns. Throws have been proven effective in MMA, although they remain quite rare. This is for many reasons I'm sure, but I'd wager the major reason is that guys have to adapt judo to no-gi is the biggest hurdle. No-gi training of course also opens of judo to a much wider world of grappling, including the huge number of wrestling tournaments as well as high profile competitions like the ADCC.

    Join with a striking art. I say boxing. Boxing because its relatively straight forward. Only a small subset of moves, but which can be refined endlessly. The lack of kicks could be a problem, but judo uses legs extensively for balance and trips as it is. Boxing coaches are also fairly easy to find. For an example of this sort of fusion, look at the the rise of the greco-roman clinch combined with dirty boxing in MMA. Highly effectve. As another clinching/grappling art, judo could easily adapt short inside punches (or elbows) both as a means of causing damage, but also as a way to set up throws.

    Training these two aspects makes judo ready-made for MMA, instead of a fringe art that is difficult to adapt to the sport.

    Argument for specailization:
    Specialization will continue. Trying to enforce specialization is the equivilant to telling guys what to train and how to train it. Everyone does martial arts there own way, which is why its so interesting in the first place. Some people (like myself) will want to train judo no-gi. Some will only want to train with the gi. Some will want to compete in a variety of tournaments, others will specifically focus in judo tournaments.

    BJJ has become more generalized with the rise of MMA; it has adopted the no-gi aspect very willingly. It also leaves room to throw in striking, self defence and MMA aspects like ground n pound. There are of course many gi specialists and gi only tournaments; all the best guys train at least partially with a gi. There is no reason why this need be any different for judo. If judo is so uninteresting that judo players will flock to generalize themselves out of throws, then judo is already dead.
  2. Hesperus is offline
    Hesperus's Avatar

    it's all vanity

    Join Date
    Feb 2008
    Location
    Great Plains
    Posts
    3,045

    Posted On:
    8/24/2009 10:22pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: Kano-Gracie

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I don't know how the rule would be worded, but it'd be cool to see pin times cut if you secure a position that would allow you to strike unimpeded and repeatedly, if it weren't against the rules, of course. Heck, maybe even start a pin count for what wouldn't otherwise be a pin if you could strike freely. If you're already pinning, for the sake of clarity I'll call getting a clear avenue for striking a strong pin. If not pinning but the opportunity is there, weak pin.

    Just to be clear, no actual striking, just scoring for the opportunity. Like why you get points for position in BJJ.

    The top crucifix that Matt Hughes loves leaves an arm free while pinning both of the uke's would be the strong pin, while the back crucifix enables lobotomy via elbow to start the weak pin count. Knees from north-south (strong) or sprawl control (weak). Elbows to the noggin from guard (weak), why not?

    Maybe the tori makes his intention clear by holding the limb in question up/away to represent its lack of control, and using it to brace or manipulate excessively would get the advanced pin waved off. Also, uke getting a limb in between the striking weapon and the target, or otherwise neutralizing the technique.

    Nightmare for timekeepers, yes, but aside from that, thoughts? What targets should get when benefits? Head and body, one value for body and a higher one for the head, head only?

    Edit: Judo+karate. Enshin tourneys, San shou, daido juku, combat sambo. There is still plenty of striking + gi grappling out there for judo to show who's boss.
    Last edited by Hesperus; 8/24/2009 10:28pm at .
  3. crusa44 is offline

    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Posts
    1

    Posted On:
    9/05/2009 6:49pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    judo

    I think judo is a great martial art. I studied it for years, and I love how you do not have to hurt your opponent that much to sub due them with judo. In outher words you have a damage control not found in other martial arts, this makes judo a peaceful mans art.

    In reguards to promoting the art I think you can do that, if people realize that bjj is a lot like judo. In fact it should be cald Brazilian judo. It is not, because when heilo and carlos learned it, it was called Kano ju jitsu.
    They chose to focus on the nawaza aspect of judo. Yet at the same time in Japan you had guys who would mostly focus on the mat work of judo. I am told this was more common in the southern part of Japan. So as you can see the two arts are so simmular. It is hard to say wich is the better, for judo players have beaten bbj players and vice versa. I know when I first read about kumora I begain to think so highly of judo, I mean the guy beat thee Gracie!!!!

    Also judo people need to talk more about the judo guys in mma, for one of them is Fedor. Also Yoshidea showed what a good judo player could do when he was in pride. I am not shure why guys like jimmy Pedro never went into mma. I mean I am sure Karo Presean has nothing on this guy.
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