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  1. CannibalCrowley is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/15/2009 9:24am


     Style: Starting Strength

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    Quote Originally Posted by gzk View Post
    I wonder if fighters could be weighed soon enough after accepting the fight, and required to be no more than y pounds over the limit, that they couldn't cut for that weigh-in, and be required to maintain that weight with periodic checks.
    You'd just end up with fighters who cut weight more often. Instead of once for the weigh in, they would be cutting for multiple weigh ins (including the initial).

    Quote Originally Posted by gzk View Post
    Is there really any way to do it and ensure fighters won't just keep subjecting their bodies to more and more torture to make the weight they want to?
    I think this is one of those things that boxing would have changed if there was a good way around it. I think the way it is now is fine, it leaves the choice up to each individual fighter.
  2. HappyOldGuy is offline
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    Slipping coal into stockings with a little sumptin for mom.

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    Posted On:
    7/15/2009 11:02am


     Style: Rehab Fu

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    Quote Originally Posted by CannibalCrowley View Post
    I think this is one of those things that boxing would have changed if there was a good way around it. I think the way it is now is fine, it leaves the choice up to each individual fighter.
    Amateur boxing and amateur wrestling have changed. Pro boxing doesn't change their rules for the reason I mentioned earlier. Fighters missing weight=cancelled championship fights=less dollars.

    But it's still not about cheating. It's about what's healthiest for the fighters. And it is (arguably) fair to hold kids sports to a higher standard for that.
  3. CannibalCrowley is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/15/2009 1:04pm


     Style: Starting Strength

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    Quote Originally Posted by HappyOldGuy View Post
    Pro boxing doesn't change their rules for the reason I mentioned earlier. Fighters missing weight=cancelled championship fights=less dollars.
    Fighters still miss weight even with the weigh ins being the day before.

    Quote Originally Posted by HappyOldGuy View Post
    But it's still not about cheating. It's about what's healthiest for the fighters. And it is (arguably) fair to hold kids sports to a higher standard for that.
    And with sports where you may be repeatedly hit in the head, it's safest to allow fighters a chance to rehydrate after weighing in since many will cut no matter how long before the fight.
  4. HappyOldGuy is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/15/2009 1:32pm


     Style: Rehab Fu

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    Quote Originally Posted by CannibalCrowley View Post
    Fighters still miss weight even with the weigh ins being the day before.



    And with sports where you may be repeatedly hit in the head, it's safest to allow fighters a chance to rehydrate after weighing in since many will cut no matter how long before the fight.
    There are risks both ways. There hasn't been a definitive study on the subject. However, the reasons why pro boxing went to 24 hour weigh ins have absolutely nothing to do with the health of the fighters. And also, most serious amateur sports are instituting extended periods of monitoring to limit the amount that competitors cut.
  5. FictionPimp is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/15/2009 11:43pm


     Style: BJJ/Judo/Boxing

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm totally against cutting weight. I simply won't do it. If I can't walk around near 155 then I won't compete at that weight.

    I think especially for amateur sports it should be illegal. One way to make it harder would be to do periodic weigh-ins leading up to the match as well as day of the match (or even hours before).. Having to cut weight 5 or 6 times in 2 or 3 months would probably make people reconsider.

    And as much as I think it should be stopped, it's not possible to stop 100%. There will always be that one guy who cuts down and can handle it. People are dishonest by nature, and if they think they can cheat it they will. Unfortunately there is no test for weight cutting.
    "a martial art that has no rules is nothing but violence" - Kenji Tomiki
  6. gzk is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/16/2009 1:16am

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     Style: BJJ, MMA

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    Quote Originally Posted by FictionPimp View Post
    Unfortunately there is no test for weight cutting.
    Can doctors somehow test for dehydration at weigh-in time? Urinalysis?
  7. BadUglyMagic is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/16/2009 9:13am


     Style: slackerjitsu

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    Quote Originally Posted by FictionPimp View Post
    I'm totally against cutting weight. I simply won't do it. If I can't walk around near 155 then I won't compete at that weight.
    I agree with the sentiment. It makes you ask the question," what is normal body weight?" How much does ones body weight fluctuate on a daily basis. Even on an off cycle you eat and take in fluids during the day. Depending on the foods, your body may retain even more fluids. A ten pound fluctuation during training may be a possiblity for me depending on environmental factors (heat, humidity), timing of food and fluid in-take, type of food and fluids ingested, frequency of emptying your bowels, blah, blah, blah.

    I normally expect a daily body weight fluctuation of 5 to 8 pounds and that weight depends on the above. The bottom of the weight is the top of the bracket. Competing at 155, ideally my expected body weight will fluctuate between 155 and 163 or 155 and 165.

    Does anyone else. have similar experiences?
  8. pepelopez is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/16/2009 10:02am

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     Style: mma

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    cheating?

    Amature wrestlers, high school anyway are checked for dehydration, USA boxing allows for weighins up to 3-5 hours (i think) before hand,

    But cutting weight is part of the fight scene, the truth is cutting weight does make you better, for 3 reasons

    #1- it makes you meaner, you should always be a little hungry before you go into the ring, that burn in your belly gives you an agressiveness

    #2- when not done to extremes it makes you faster, sure it can be taken to excess but so can just about anything else

    #3-it focuses you, not only during training time but also during meal time, it sets you apart from others who will not push it to excell, sorry that sounds harsh but it is true, I've seen it through 6 years of Jr high wrestling, 4 years of Karate & my 10 months & 2 mma fights, you can look at a fighter & tell when he hasn't cut weight!

    On a side note it seems as though through most of combat sports, i.e. boxing, wrestling, kickboxing, MT ect cutting weight is part of the fabric of the sport, forgive me if this is getting off topic but does anyone else notice the TAPOUT mentality of turning mma into more of the X games & less of a sport? I only bring it up because no wrestler or boxer would ever question wether or not cutting weight is cheating, perhaps we have gone to far in the TAPOUT attitude direction?
  9. madrigan is offline

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    Posted On:
    7/16/2009 10:21am


     

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    Quote Originally Posted by pepelopez View Post
    On a side note it seems as though through most of combat sports, i.e. boxing, wrestling, kickboxing, MT ect cutting weight is part of the fabric of the sport, forgive me if this is getting off topic but does anyone else notice the TAPOUT mentality of turning mma into more of the X games & less of a sport? I only bring it up because no wrestler or boxer would ever question wether or not cutting weight is cheating, perhaps we have gone to far in the TAPOUT attitude direction?
    The approaches to MMA as a sport are not limited to 1) Fighter who will do just about anything to achieve some real or imagined edge in a fight and 2) Tapout dood.

    I'm neither a fighter nor a Tapout dood, and personally I find the entire practice of weight cutting ridiculous and disturbing, regardless of whether it might offer some advantage to an athlete -- an advantage of which I'd like to see some scientific evidence. Really, all this talk about cutting being part of the fabric of the sport is irrelevant. If it's unethical or unhealthy, it doesn't matter if it's a common or longstanding. It needs to be evaluated on its own merits.

    Excellence and masculinity are not defined by "extremeness" or self-endangerment.
  10. lt_flippy is offline
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    Posted On:
    7/16/2009 11:22am


     Style: Dirty

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Don't they do the hydration tests where you pee in a cup and they check the water gravity? If not, they should.
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