ATTN: Any Rickson Gracie Representative (possible fraud)

**tetsuo** · Posted On: 6/26/2009 7:40am

Hello,

Recently, a club proposing to study jiu-jitsu and vale tudo opens in
the city of Nantes, in France (Europa).

The main instructor is called Zenon Rocha.

Some of its students claim on french mma forums that he received his black belt from Rickson Gracie.

This stirs some controversy in the little world of french jiu-jitsu, as
nowhere in the Internet it can be found any mention of this fact (and no proofs are given).

Can someone on this forum clear it up, or submit it to knowledgeable pepeole?

Thanks.

Yan Onyme.

**MrJ** · Posted On: 7/09/2009 12:59pm

Is this person claiming to be a BJJ black belt himself? Perhaps you could contact him directly to ask where he trained, under which instructors and rank achieved under what association. Anyone can say anything on a discussion board. If you want to contact a Rickson Gracie representative directly, they should be easy to find via Google.

Please read the stickies for MABS - this isn't the way to begin a thread in this forum. There isn't enough information here to call bullshit on someone.

**Sam Browning** · Posted On: 7/09/2009 1:49pm

http://rickson.com/association/rep-int.html

http://rickson.com/association/rep-usa.html

He's not an international representative. Or on the American List.

They have some e-mail addresses on this page.
http://rickson.com/contact.htm

association@rickson.com

But now that I've helped you its time for the obligatory French joke. Why do French women like American service men.

Answer: They like to sleep with a winner who won't call her Fraulien!

**Lysol** · Posted On: 7/09/2009 4:14pm

Originally Posted by tetsuo

Hello,

Some of its students claim on french mma forums that he received his black belt from Rickson Gracie.

And some Americans claim George Washington invented cocaine (Source: YouTube - George Washington ). As long as he himself isn't making the claims, he's fine. Does this club have a website? Perhaps the site clears up where he got his black belt.

It's pretty common for students to lie about how much of a badass their instructor is (A lot of 3rd place awards mysteriously become winner's medals when their students see them), but that said, it is also the instructor's responsibility to point out claims about him that are false. If someone claims he's a Rickson Gracie blackbelt (assuming he isn't), and he says nothing because it makes him look good, then yeah, it's on him. Are these claims all on a small message board or word of mouth, or are these claims being published in newspapers or some other place where he would have a chance to deny them?

**tetsuo** · Posted On: 7/10/2009 3:02am

@MrJ: Thanks for the insight, I'm going to read these stickies right now.
@Samule Browning: The joke is fun and the better is I didn't know it.
@Lysol: I'll try to contact the guy when he'll come back from Brazil.

Thanks you all for your help.

**Lebell** · Posted On: 7/11/2009 5:53am

Originally Posted by tetsuo

Hello,

Recently, a club proposing to study jiu-jitsu and vale tudo opens in
the city of Nantes, in France (Europa).

The main instructor is called Zenon Rocha.

Some of its students claim on french mma forums that he received his black belt from Rickson Gracie.

This stirs some controversy in the little world of french jiu-jitsu, as
nowhere in the Internet it can be found any mention of this fact (and no proofs are given).

Can someone on this forum clear it up, or submit it to knowledgeable pepeole?

Thanks.

Yan Onyme.

This is easy, there's one black belt under rickson in europe, and he lives in holland,oss.
he got promoted yesterday by rickson who is in Holland now.

**TheDingo** · Posted On: 7/11/2009 9:13am

Are we talking about this club in particular:

http://www.noomba-sport.com/combat-libre/1750.html

On this article, Zenon Rocha is only referred to as a teacher.

http://www.nantes.maville.com/actual...-57881045.html

Here's the thread in question that brings up the blackbelt status. My french comprehension is mediocre these days. Perhaps someone with better french can take a read to see what the background comes of this thread to the topic at hand.

http://www.ikusa.fr/modules.php?ModP...66878ad316be58

To the OP, Is this vid of the guy in question?
YouTube - vale tudo zenon

**Lebell** · Posted On: 7/11/2009 9:33am

that board in french mentions him and his claims, they are sceptical.
then this guy comes up and says:LOL there's this dude in Brest who got his belt from Carlson Gracie even when he's dead for 2 years! lolol'

Then the guy from the Brest academy comes on the thread ad starts defending himself.

French version of Bullshido. ;-)

okay here's proof enough:

Nieuws 8 Juli
Harold heeft zijn Zwart Band ontvangen van Rickson Gracie. Bij deze is hij de eerste BlackBelt van Rickson Gracie in Europa.

It says:Harold received his black belt from Rickson Gracie, making him the first black belt under Rickson Gracie in Europe.

source:http://bjjholland.nl/index.php/nieuws

**Lysol** · Posted On: 7/11/2009 9:58am

Okay then: Claims made on a site he has more than likely seen, and almost definately supplied the author with his background. There goes my whole "As long as he didn't say it..." defense. And I really wanted to give him benefit of the doubt too...