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  1. Munacra is offline
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    I Ducked Out on a Gong Sau

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    Posted On:
    3/20/2009 1:21am


     Style: Gentleman Adventurer

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    When I am really high, I can see God sometimes. Perhaps the same proves true for Kung Fu?
  2. theotherserge is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/20/2009 1:45am

    Join us... or die
     Style: sambo/crossfit

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Munacra View Post
    When I am really high, I can see God sometimes. Perhaps the same proves true for Kung Fu?

    I can' even keep track of what the hell Wing Chun thread I'm subscribed to; and new ones are popping up!

    YouTube - Airplane!- The Wrong Week to Quit

    ---------- Post added at 06:45 AM ---------- Previous post was at 06:43 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Kintanon View Post
    The DEFAULT STATE of an assertion is that it is false. If there is no proof that the assertion is true then we will continue to believe it is false until some evidence appears to indicate otherwise.
    The same as if I said I could fly. The default state is disbelief. No evidence = no belief.
    must...end...thread....NOW!!

    YouTube - Dr. Strangelove - Precious Bodily Fluids
    Many things we do naturally become difficult only when we try to make them intellectual subjects. It is possible to know so much about a subject that you become totally ignorant.
    -Mentat Text Two (dicto)
  3. hitandrun is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/20/2009 2:14am


     

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by wingchunx2z View Post
    Wing chun is awsome, if tom cruise had known wing chun he wouldv't beaten the machine gun weilding japanese army at the end and the bald due wouldnt have died. Such a shame..
    Oh yeah, he'll be deadly for sure...




  4. new2bjj is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/20/2009 7:08pm


     Style: TKD, MT, KEMPO

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I'm coming into the end here, but 7 years is a long time to become proficient at anything. What I mean is, it must be awfully convoluted to have to spend that much time to use it effectively. Guys go from being 14 years old to world class boxers, at least highly skilled ones in 7 years. Same with BJJ, Judo or Kickboxing.

    If it is all that, then more then a few guys would be stepping into the ocatgon using Chun. They had that one JKD guy on TUF, but that is hardly Wing Chun. There are just too many avenues to real testing now to let some of these things pass anymore. IF not the octogan, why aren't there a lot of Wing Chun guys winning Sanda tournaments? And I don't mean on or two, I mean lots. But hey, if it makes you happy, do it.
    "Coffee is for Closers" GlenGarry Glenross
  5. wingchunx2z is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/21/2009 8:57am


     Style: Wing Chun

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by new2bjj View Post
    I'm coming into the end here, but 7 years is a long time to become proficient at anything. What I mean is, it must be awfully convoluted to have to spend that much time to use it effectively. Guys go from being 14 years old to world class boxers, at least highly skilled ones in 7 years. Same with BJJ, Judo or Kickboxing.

    If it is all that, then more then a few guys would be stepping into the ocatgon using Chun. They had that one JKD guy on TUF, but that is hardly Wing Chun. There are just too many avenues to real testing now to let some of these things pass anymore. IF not the octogan, why aren't there a lot of Wing Chun guys winning Sanda tournaments? And I don't mean on or two, I mean lots. But hey, if it makes you happy, do it.
    K I'll step up and answer someof that. First off in my opinion wing chun is much more complex and difficult to use properly than a boxing style. The primary reasoning for this is in boxing the defenses are genrally very non proactive. A proactive defense as I'm saying is when you actually use your hand/wrist to redirect/block the incoming limb. Bpoxing will occasionally parry the jab but it has been my expereince that with power straights and hooks you wither cover up, slip it, use head and core movement, or you comb the back of your headand point your elbowacross your face while turning to rdirect hooks. This defneseis the simplest and statistically most sucessfull approach to defending a punch. So boxing and kickboxing appraoches will rely on distance movement and simply covering up so the intended target is shut off to avoid being hurt. In addition to this because boxing doesnt try to intercept the punch in mid strike they dont have to worry about timing distance and structure so that they land in exactly the right spot and thier block isnt overwhelmed by a power punch. This will take considerably more time to master since these factors are all present in proactive blocking.

    Wing chun has proactive blocks in that the incoming punch is redirected and a simultaneous punch is thrown. if the attacker slips around the simultaneous punch then the punching hand that is already extended needs to be ready to shoot otu again and block the next punch. This movement alone is very difficult to get but it is not as limited as acovering defense. Since your hands are already out there engaged as long as you can maintain structure and defense then you ahve more options for moving in, exiting, creating didtance, clenhcing shooting in, trapping, ect. I was working on this just last night in sparring wiht my freind inclass and I was showing him how some boxers will use head movement on thier first punch so the simultaneous strike may no necesarilly land and you will need to use the punchign hand to redirect the next punch since you dont have time to retract it then shoot it out again.

    In any case, this should provide you a little better understanding of perhaps why wing chun may take longer than a less compliated art.

    As for why no UFC wing chun. I dont know to be hoenst. I think it's,a mix between our art not being made for competition and most of our attacks are going to violate any sanctioned mma orginization's rules; and the embarassment that asbel cancio brought us in his UFC debut.

    Other than that I can only speculate.. Hope this helps.
  6. Lindz is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/21/2009 9:03am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by wingchunx2z View Post
    This defneseis the simplest and statistically most sucessfull approach to defending a punch.
    I beg your pardon but did you just say boxing has the best defence against punches?
  7. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/21/2009 9:29am

    staff
     Style: xingyi

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Negation View Post
    Why do somethign unproven like Wing Chun in this modern, skeptical day and age when you have proof all around you of training methods that actually work for the purpose you desire?
    We tried this already.

    Quote Originally Posted by wingchunx2z View Post
    K I'll step up and answer someof that. First off in my opinion wing chun is much more complex and difficult to use properly than a boxing style. block the next punch. This movement alone is very difficult to get but it is not as limited as acovering defense.Blah Blah Blah Blah Blah ..................
    Your lack of years in kung fu do not relate to the garbage you like to spew.


    Quick note to all stupid Kung Fu practitioners/Instructors.


    LEARNING HOW TO FIGHT IS NOT COMPLEX.
  8. theotherserge is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/21/2009 2:30pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: sambo/crossfit

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by It is Fake View Post
    We tried this already.

    Your lack of years in kung fu do not relate to the garbage you like to spew.


    Quick note to all stupid Kung Fu practitioners/Instructors.


    LEARNING HOW TO FIGHT IS NOT COMPLEX.
    maybe they are not that stupid, the sifus I mean

    Like a therapist who figures out how to make you happier/better adjusted/serene/etc in two years isn't going to get as much $ out of your ass as the one who takes 7 years 3x a week@$150/hour.

    *ruminates*
    Many things we do naturally become difficult only when we try to make them intellectual subjects. It is possible to know so much about a subject that you become totally ignorant.
    -Mentat Text Two (dicto)
  9. Last_Samurai is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/21/2009 11:20pm


     Style: Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Hesperus View Post
    ...yes, you can.

    Positive claims (God DOES exist, Chun DOES work) require positive proof.

    Instead of "good" or "bad", we should have a true dichotomy: good or not good.

    Until there is proof that Chun (as an entity, the bulk of its practitioners [yes, what they call themselves counts when they suck], compared to other proven systems) is good, it is not good.

    ---------- Post added at 01:19 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:15 AM ----------

    Also, publicly bitching about rep is a bannable offense.

    I neg rep'd you, you whiny bitch, and I'd do it again in a heartbeat.

    Also, I've been posting in this thread since before you joined, so I don't know what the **** you're talking about.
    I thought trolling was a bannable offence. I find it hard to see you can say I am wrong when you didn't even engage in conversation with me. You were just talking about me behind my back.

    I am not whinning about rep. I think it fortunate for myself I don't pride my ego on internet icons. I am just here to talk with people, it is a shame I can't do that without people trying to insult me.

    Your idea of good and not good is flawed. It means you can easily pass incorrect judgement upon something. You should be sceptical of something if you don't know about it, but you can't just say it's wrong when you admit you have no fucking idea; that is equally as blind as being religous or believing your overweight Sifu.

    Anyway, we both know the bulk of Chun guys suck, they occassionally put forward vids of sparring and even the odd MMA challenge is accepted, and they get owned every time. It is a shame people here arn't reading my posts and quote me without even knowing what I'm talking about.
  10. Last_Samurai is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/21/2009 11:27pm


     Style: Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by new2bjj View Post
    I'm coming into the end here, but 7 years is a long time to become proficient at anything. What I mean is, it must be awfully convoluted to have to spend that much time to use it effectively. Guys go from being 14 years old to world class boxers, at least highly skilled ones in 7 years. Same with BJJ, Judo or Kickboxing.
    But wasn't Kung Fu made for and by monks who really didn't want to fight? They just wanted to **** around with themselves to get some personal advancment and wisdom out of it to help achieve their enlightenment. Right?

    What you're saying is not much different than saying boxing is **** because you've got an AK-47 and learned how to use it in just 7 minutes; all things are worth while in their own place. Perhaps you're compairing Kung Fu to something it doesn't belong with? Same as the Boxer Vs. Taliban dude?

    Do not believe deluded modern day guys doing Kung Fu for all the wrong reasons.
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