Su Kong Tai Djin

[Leodom]

You know, I've seen this subject come up a couple of other times in the short time I've been on this board. Everyone automatically discounts the school/style because a grandmaster had a genetic defect causing him to be covered in hair. Does anyone have any real evidence that it's BS or is it just "hairy guys must be fake". Again, I have yet to read any evidence that the lineage is fake.

[Mr. Mantis]

I have heard bizzare claims from Shaolin Do people. So bizzare that they are impossible. I have been told that Bob Green from one of the Kentucky shaolin Do schools did a block break without moving his hand. The claim was that he placed his hand on the block and it broke using his fajing or something like that. I have also been told that it is on video tape, yet they refuse to publish it.

I believe that the students may be being brainwashed to an extent of what abilities they can expect, but I am not certain.

[Skummer]

There have been many threads on this subject over at KFO. I found two non-shaolindo sites that mention Tai Djin, but they may have gotten their info from shaolindo.

I also found a pic of a guy named Li Baoshu on a site about hypertrichosis in china. This Li Baoshu looks suspiciously similar to Tai Djin and he was displayed at the Beijing zoo in the 1920's. Also, there's a pic floating around of Tai Djin with his arm in a bear's mouth.

The problem with Tai Djin and his lineage is the fact that no one seems to be able to verify his existence in the southern (Fukien) shaolin temple. If a single man, particularly chewbacca, masters over 50 shaolin styles, you'd think he'd be well-known. Then again, there's controversy as to whether there was a Fukien temple at all, so...

[Xuanlong Xian]

no need for lineage disputes. the claims shaolindo makes are patently ridiculous. Sin Kwang The became "inheriting grandmaster" of Shaolin as a teenager after mastering 900+ forms?

Notice the curricula they post. Entire kungfu styles are listed among the literally hundreds of forms and routines students have to learn. Bullshido to the max.

[Balloonknot]

XX is correct. Bullshido to the upmostest max!!!

[Skummer]

Originally posted by Xuanlong Xian
no need for lineage disputes. the claims shaolindo makes are patently ridiculous. Sin Kwang The became "inheriting grandmaster" of Shaolin as a teenager after mastering 900+ forms?

Notice the curricula they post. Entire kungfu styles are listed among the literally hundreds of forms and routines students have to learn. Bullshido to the max.

Sadly, I must agree. Though I believe Sin The claims to have recieved GM status in his late 20's.

I have a peculiar perspective on this issue since I was a shaolindo student for a few years. During that time I learnt very little actually useful things, but I did learn lots of forms. I became fed up with unrealistic training, so I put a notice on the bulletin board at the school asking for people to spar and/or practice technique in a realistic manner. One black belt said he'd push hands with me, and that's it. 2 weeks later I quit and started judo.

I'm torn here because, while I agree the lineage is bogus and the training is less than adequate, I grew to enjoy the company of many in the system. The sifu at the school I attended is of the highest character and I consider him a friend. It makes me very sad to boldly say the system is bogus since he and others love & devote so much time to it.

[Xuanlong Xian]

I have pretty much the same experience with CMD.

Some of the instructors clearly had high character, were intelligent, and loved what they trained. I really don't know how it would change their lives to realize the truth about the system.

[Robbastard]

Originally posted by miguksaram
Moving to General Discussion....not history related.

I assumed the initial question would be history related, but I guess the smart-assed comments changed the nature of the post.

[Xuanlong Xian]

once Su Kong Tai Jin has some credible inheritors, maybe someone will care to investigate him.

[Robbastard]

Originally posted by Skummer
I also found a pic of a guy named Li Baoshu on a site about hypertrichosis in china. This Li Baoshu looks suspiciously similar to Tai Djin and he was displayed at the Beijing zoo in the 1920's. Also, there's a pic floating around of Tai Djin with his arm in a bear's mouth.

Thanks for the info.

I found a pic of Li Baoshu

Unfortunately, it's difficult to tell if they're the same guy, though they do seem to be contemporaries (Tai Djin reported;y died in 1926). Here are the only two pics I've found of Tai Djin:




Do you know where I can find the pic with the bear?

Originally posted by Skummer
The problem with Tai Djin and his lineage is the fact that no one seems to be able to verify his existence in the southern (Fukien) shaolin temple. If a single man, particularly chewbacca, masters over 50 shaolin styles, you'd think he'd be well-known. Then again, there's controversy as to whether there was a Fukien temple at all, so...

True. Shaolin Do isn't the only art that claims lineage from the Southern Temple (Hung-Gar is another, IIRC). From what I've seen, however, Tai Djin seems only to be acknowledged by the Shaolin Do system. However, if Tai Djin was truly not connected to a Shaolin temple, where did he come from (assuming he was a real martial artist of course)?

Apparently a temple of some kind existed in the south, as there were excavations in the 1990s. From what I've read, however, that temple was destroyed about 150 years before Tai Djin's time. I did find this article on the southern temple, which seems fairly objective, on a Hung-Gar website:
http://www.hungkuen.net/history-riddleofshaolin.htm
http://www.hungkuen.net/history-riddleofshaolin2.htm
http://www.hungkuen.net/history-riddleofshaolin3.htm

As to my other question, has anyone here actually seen Sin Kwang The or Ie Chang Ming in action?