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  1. nnate is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/05/2009 1:12pm


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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinister-6000 View Post
    You are arrogant enough to say that you know more about what "real" silat is than a man who had been practicing silat for more than 40 years who had it in his lineage? Really?
    Ah yes, an appeal to authority. Who's the arrogant one?
  2. nnate is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/05/2009 1:19pm


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    Quote Originally Posted by Kris Kringle-Jime View Post
    I refuse to lower my standards enough to consider the Silat sparring we're seeing here worthwhile. Yes it's fantastic that an art that we've determined (over 35 pages) to consider video the same as stealing its soul has finally decided to allow itself to be filmed. Yes it's fantastic that an art apparently predicated on the silliest of ridiculous techniques is allowing some form of sparring. Yes, there were even a few so-so kick catches in the first video.

    But let's not get caught up in a swirl of "they spar! WAHOOO!" Unless I'm drastically misunderstanding the rules or goals of Silat sparring, it sucks.
    The only thing that really impressed me was the throws/slams. Otherwise it reminded me of pretty crappy pointfighting.

    One thing I think that should be commended is that given the secretive/cult-like nature of Silat, anyone who steps up and actually spars probably gets a lot of **** from "real" Silat guys.
  3. Blue Negation is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/05/2009 1:39pm


     Style: Judo, Sub wrestling

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    Quote Originally Posted by Naszir View Post
    It actually tends to present itself at Dog Brothers gatherings quite a bit. Crafty (Marc Denny) uses a lot of sapus for takedowns. Also, a technique was used in the Sokudjou/Mousasi fight. Please understand I am not asserting that Mousasi is a silat player, but he did use a harimau takedown in that fight.
    Harimau takedown
    It's also a regular ol' tripod sweep from BJJ.
  4. Sinister-6000 is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/05/2009 1:58pm


     Style: JJ, Karate, JKD, Silat

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by nnate View Post
    Ah yes, an appeal to authority. Who's the arrogant one?
    This is hilarious. Since when did someone who doesnt practice a trade validly know more about that trade then a man who has spent 4 decades in it? Yes, he was an authority in his own art and an encyclopedia of knowledge.
  5. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/05/2009 2:04pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinister-6000 View Post
    This is hilarious. Since when did someone who doesnt practice a trade validly know more about that trade then a man who has spent 4 decades in it?
    You do realize this isn't as logical as you think.

    Yes, he was an authority in his own art and an encyclopedia of knowledge.
    Okay Grandmaster Sin Kwan The is an authority of his own art as well. He is also an encyclopedia of knowledge.

    Just saying that this isn't what you want to base your argument off of on bullshido.

    wait is this going to be the sport kind of silat....or are they going to go in quick and do things like elbowing past the knee as a takedown, misaligning the spine, doing forearm hacks to the ribs and neck...."
    Oh boy.

    Enjoy yourself.
  6. nnate is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/05/2009 4:55pm


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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinister-6000 View Post
    This is hilarious. Since when did someone who doesnt practice a trade validly know more about that trade then a man who has spent 4 decades in it? Yes, he was an authority in his own art and an encyclopedia of knowledge.
    Question 1: Do you understand what the Appeal to Authority logical fallacy is?

    Question 2: Do you understand the concept of aliveness, as it applies to martial arts?

    Question 3: Do you understand why static compliant demos are held in lower regard to techniques used against a fully resistant opponent?

    Question 4: How do you post on Bullshido on a regular basis without seeming to understand that you will get a lot of flak and skepticism when you post videos of compliant videos as evidence of a technique's effectiveness?

    Question 5: Do you know that you could post a video of "good" Silat that is practiced in an alive stting, and then watch a lot of people shut the **** up? Do you know how short this thread would be if you had done that in the first place?
  7. Naszir is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/05/2009 5:19pm


     Style: BJJ, Judo, SAMBO

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Negation View Post
    It's also a regular ol' tripod sweep from BJJ.
    Yes, because people in Indonesia have the same physical structure as people in Brazil. It's the same reason the triangle choke was in harimau before the Dutch showed up and the Japanese developed the sankaku-jime. Ude-garami is also a top double wrist lock. People's bodies are pretty much the same the world around.
  8. Sinister-6000 is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/05/2009 5:31pm


     Style: JJ, Karate, JKD, Silat

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by nnate View Post
    Question 1: Do you understand what the Appeal to Authority logical fallacy is?

    Question 2: Do you understand the concept of aliveness, as it applies to martial arts?

    Question 3: Do you understand why static compliant demos are held in lower regard to techniques used against a fully resistant opponent?

    Question 4: How do you post on Bullshido on a regular basis without seeming to understand that you will get a lot of flak and skepticism when you post videos of compliant videos as evidence of a technique's effectiveness?

    Question 5: Do you know that you could post a video of "good" Silat that is practiced in an alive stting, and then watch a lot of people shut the **** up? Do you know how short this thread would be if you had done that in the first place?

    1) no, not particularly but I imagine it has something to do with "only they have the knowledge so we should not question them?"

    2) Yes. I also understand that both filipino and indo arts can be harder than most to pull off in an alive setting because of the complexity of techniques. But at the same time silat has a great delivery system of getting to where they need to be and that is why jkd takes aspects of silat and adds it into their curriculum as do many other crosstraining/mixed martial artists.

    3)yes. Im not really sure why I thought that would be a good example of a video except for the ease and speed of his takedowns to transition into submission~neck crank is a great example of the silat flow

    4) I know i will get a lot of flak, it doesnt bother me too much, im not much of an arguer or name-caller. I dont have the energy or care enough too haha :)

    5) Yea ....wish it wasnt me who had to post it though because like Jim J., i dont want to be contacted/excommunicated for showing some basic techniques. I dont know why its like this but as we've discussed its a sensitive issue..
  9. nnate is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/05/2009 5:54pm


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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinister-6000 View Post
    1) no, not particularly but I imagine it has something to do with "only they have the knowledge so we should not question them?"
    Yeah, that's more or less it.


    2) Yes. I also understand that both filipino and indo arts can be harder than most to pull off in an alive setting because of the complexity of techniques. But at the same time silat has a great delivery system of getting to where they need to be and that is why jkd takes aspects of silat and adds it into their curriculum as do many other crosstraining/mixed martial artists.
    Most of this is superfluous. A simple yes would suffice. Instead you add on more claims about silat without proof, which is the crux of the problem.


    3)yes. Im not really sure why I thought that would be a good example of a video except for the ease and speed of his takedowns to transition into submission~neck crank is a great example of the silat flow
    Anything can look fast and easy with a cooperative opponent. That's the problem.


    4) I know i will get a lot of flak, it doesnt bother me too much, im not much of an arguer or name-caller. I dont have the energy or care enough too haha :)
    Then why do it? Why continually make claims without proof in the presence of a bunch of empiricists? You're not getting anything done, and you're not going to convince anyone about anything.

    5) Yea ....wish it wasnt me who had to post it though because like Jim J., i dont want to be contacted/excommunicated for showing some basic techniques. I dont know why its like this but as we've discussed its a sensitive issue..
    I don't think Bullshido excommunicates people for showing basic techniques. In fact, alive demonstrations usually garner praise.
  10. It is Fake is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/05/2009 6:11pm

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    Quote Originally Posted by nnate View Post


    I don't think Bullshido excommunicates people for showing basic techniques. In fact, alive demonstrations usually garner praise.
    I think he is actually talking about silat not bullshido.

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