Posted On:1/12/2004 11:25am
Once more, could you elaborate on the physical screening aspects and what types of conditioning tests a SEAL would most likely have to accomplish?
Posted On:1/12/2004 1:45pm
The POW Network Style: none
The PST (physical screen test) is generally given during Boot Camp to any/all who wish to try out for the SEAL program. Paperwork (there's ALWAYS paperwork) has to be completed ahead of time, but compared to the paper nightmare later on, it's a breeze.
Clothing for those taking the PST is standard 'boondocker' boots, dungaree trousers, and a T-shirt... and a swim suit for the swim test.
First stop is the pool, with a requirement to swim a specified distance in a specified (fairly easy) period of time. I think it was 500 yds in something like 7 minutes. Only two types of swim stroke are permitted - side stroke and breast stroke - both of them being underwater 'recovery' strokes in that the hands stay below the surface at all times.
Those who complete the swim in the alloted time get dressed and muster outside for the PT portion.
PT portion of the test is done by applicants pairing off to assist/monitor each other. The test includes the following:
- 2 minutes of pushups (minimum number to be accomplished, and form is carefully observed).
- 2 minutes of situps (minimum number to be accomplished, and elbows to rake both knees each repetition).
- 2 minutes of 4-count squat-thrusts - squat, kick out to pushup 'leaning rest' position, jump back to squat, stand up (minimum number to be performed, no knees on the ground).
All who met the minimum numbers of each exercise are mustered for a 1.5 mile timed run... begun immediately following all the exercises with the very minimum rest while qualifiers are identified.
Run is conducted and all those who qualify are mustered at the pull-up bar... where each must complete 9 GOOD pull ups in a specified time period - palms facing away from body, shoulder width apart, legs hanging straight and ankles crossed... no 'bicycling' permitted.
That's the test as I took it in 1970. Out of a couple hundred guys who tried out, there were 5 or 6 of us who made it to the end... three of those men ended up in my BUD/S class, and all three of them graduated with me. In fact, when my class graduated with 54 men in Feb 1971, it was the largest class to have ever graduated up to that point in time. Our class officers were the best of the best, and our senior class officer was a charismatic wonder - they truly were inspirational leaders. Without them we would have had a head count of only HALF of what we graduated.
Anyone desiring very specific information regarding the exact number of repetitions of each exercise, the swim distance and minimum time, and the minimum time for the run can consult the official Navy web site - www.swcc.navy.mil/seal. Things change over time, and the exact type of exercises and the number of repetitions required may be different than what I described above. If anyone is seriously contemplating an attempt at the SEAL Teams, I'd sure like to hear from you. My email address is in my profile... USE IT!
Of course, this is just the SCREEN TEST to see if you are accepted to START training. Once you get to BUD/S training, things get really "interesting". I cannot begin to describe it here, and direct your attention to the various shows about BUD/S that air fairly regularly on the Discovery Channel and the History Channel.
Ultimately the washout/dropout rate for BUD/S training averages something between 60% and 80%. My class had a starting roster of 110 men, and we blew out the grading curve with a 50% SURVIVAL rate! To the best of my knowledge it is still a statistic that stands alone.
Hope that answers your question. If not, lemme know.
Steve Robinson RM2(SEAL)
SEAL Team ONE
Inshore Undersea Warfare Group ONE
-UDT-SEAL Association - Member
-POW Network Board of Directors
-Naval Special Warfare Archives - SOF Analyst/Contributing Journalist
-Disabled American Veterans - Life Member
-FORMER Special Investigator - SEAL Authentication Team
-CyberSEALs.org - Webmaster
-Author - NO GUTS, NO GLORY - Unmasking Navy SEAL Imposters
Posted On:1/12/2004 1:51pm
Thanks for the info and the link. My time is far past.
I see quotes at times implying that SEALs believe the human body is capable of ten times what we think it is.
I always held the Army Rangers in high esteem as well.
Posted On:1/12/2004 2:51pm
Style: Shi Ja Quan
SEAL Min. PT hasn't changed that much at all has it?
How long before a SEAL does a HALO or HAHO ?
Posted On:1/12/2004 3:35pm
Style: Mauy Thai
Originally posted by KageReaper
Ok..I've wondered about this since basic....
Is it possible.....
to pick up chicks in a tank??
That almost brought a tear to my eye...
Last edited by Meteora; 1/12/2004 3:37pm at .
"ARGH SURF NINJAS *implodes* " the cruel fate of Stold3
Posted On:1/12/2004 5:14pm
I have a question for you
william cheung has claimed to have trained with the seals can you verify this and possibly give us a list of people who have trained navy seals that you know of?
Rolls With Sweaty Men!
Posted On:1/12/2004 6:34pm
Thanks for your answers. Back to Marcinko, what are your feelings on Red Cell? I have heard very conflicting stories about it's validity and the actions that it undertoook.
Posted On:1/12/2004 7:03pm
I think the fact that we got a SEAL to drop in and answer questions makes Bullshido officially the coolest site ever.
Posted On:1/12/2004 8:22pm
serious nutriding going here..
Posted On:1/12/2004 8:44pm
Okay... I'll try to answer these questions and comments in the order they were presented.
Yes... one of the principle premises of the SEAL training program is the human body is capable of MANY times more than most people imagine. The popular quote currently is "The human body is capable of TEN TIMES what the normal person perceives possible". Back when I was in training it was regularly stated that the human body was capable of TWENTY times what is normally perceived as its limits. Ten times... TWENTY times... the basic premise is that normal people perceive their physical and mental limits to be far less than they are actually capable of reaching. When properly motivated and trained, it is possible to call upon those untapped capabilities.
It has been said for many years that if there is one thing a man in the SEAL Teams knows, it is the TRUE limits of his physical and mental capabilities... and how to regularly push to the very edge of those limits.
Oh... and the Army Rangers ARE a superbly trained military unit with an awesome heritage of military accomplishments. I urge all of you to do a little GOOGLE searching and read up on the Ranger actions on D-Day in WWII... and their attack on the gun positions on Point du Hoc. At the end of the day I think there were only a double handful who weren't wounded. They accomplished absolutely amazing things under really unbelievable circumstances... and that proud heritage is being upheld by todays Rangers. If you need proof, I direct your attention to the BLACKHAWK DOWN story about Task Force Ranger in Mogadishu, Somalia.
Okay, next comment/question - HALO and HAHO training. A man generally gets the first platoon deployment out of the way and gets some operational experience under his belt before he is sent to learn HALO (High Altitude Low Opening) and HAHO (High Altitude High Opening) parachuting tactics and techniques. There are always exceptions to such scheduling conventions, and ultimately the guys get to the school whenever they can manage it in their schedules.
Next one - William Cheung - NEVER HEARD OF HIM! He isn't a SEAL (not in the database) so any training he participated in "with the SEALs" is something of short-term nature and puts him into a category that includes everybody and anybody who has ever run down the beach at the same time as the guys on the Teams. By this I mean that just about anyone who has been in the SEAL compound for any reason at all can claim to have "trained with the SEALs".
By the same token, a HUGE number of SEALs enjoy the martial arts and eventually spend some time in a commercial dojo somewhere. When that happens, and more than one SEAL has spent time in a dojo for instruction, no matter how long or short a time they were there, the guys running the dojo almost invariably add statements such as "Trained US Navy SEALs" or "US Navy SEAL Unarmed Combat Instructor" to their advertising. SELDOM do they use a statement like "Students have included US Navy SEALs" - a statement that would be far more accurate and far less misleading. The first two statements carry the implication that the guy from the dojo is also a Navy SEAL, without actually coming out and making the false statement. And I'll guarantee they don't go out of their way to correct the misinterpretation (until the AuthentiSEALs bring it to EVERYONE'S attention, that is).
As for a list of MA guys who have trained SEALs... the number is sure to be HUGE, but I do not know of any listing of such individuals. Any time a guy spends in his off hours at a dojo is his own business, and certainly doesn't qualify for entry in his military records.
All of the official HTH instruction in the BUD/S unit is done by the active duty US Navy instructors (all of whom are SEALs). All of the official HTH instruction I received while with SEAL Team ONE was presented by other SEALs... but that was 30+ years ago. I don't have the knowledge necessary to address the situation regarding possible civilian instructors presenting such courses in the Team compound over the intervening years.
The RED CELL team was created to test military base security against potential intrusion by Soviet Russian agents (thus the term "Red"). The unit was very effective in revealing potential 'holes' in security. The members of the RED CELL unit played by their own rules... that is to say NO RULES. Prior to the activities of the RED CELL unit, base security had always been something that the base CO and his people evaluated on their own. Good intentions didn't necessarily make for good results, and it was not uncommon for a "passing grade" to be stipulated BEFORE the inspection was even carried out. No CO wanted to look like he wasn't doing his job!
There was controversy about the tactics employed by RED CELL operatives... but that was primarily a result of complaints brought by those whose security was found wanting. The Red Cell folks "detained" key personnel and "convinced" them to reveal base access codes, schedules, etc. It was of course completely unrealistic to expect that Soviet Russian agents would be "gentle" with someone they apprehended, or would not use virtually any means to obtain desired information. The base personnel attempted to impose unrealistic limitations on Red Cell, such as "you can only enter the base through the main gate". HAH! So the Red Cell guys cut a chain and go in through a back gate... and the base guys screamed "unfair!"
Bottom line... the SEAL Team guys working the Red Cell ops did what they were tasked to do. Such exercises testing security are now a fairly regular occurance on most ships and bases... and the realistic, "no holds barred" tactics originated by Red Cell are now standard procedure.
That about does it. As for my participation making BULLSHIDO "officially the coolest site ever"... I think it was already a really cool site without me. I was unaware of its existence until I was invited to participate by making a "guest appearance" on the discussion board. I'm glad I looked into it, and plan on keeping my membership active after this particular discussion thread is ended.
I am ALWAYS anxious for TRUTH IN ADVERTISING to win out over misleading advertising... and that's the basic concept behind the site. I have been VERY impressed with the level of intelligence evident in the majority of the postings I've looked at. There are some good jabs back and forth (indicative of a healthy climate that encourages individual expression), questions are (for the most part) intelligent and thought-provoking. There's always room for joking, and there's plenty of it here... but that just makes it all the more fun.
Oh... and I particularly enjoyed the review of the BLOODSPORT movie linked through the main page. Both my wife and I have seen the movie and we both laughed our asses off. The author of THAT piece has a definite future as a standup comedian!
This board does VERY WELL in comparison to other discussion boards I've visited. I'd invite anyone who is interested in learning more about the SEAL Teams to visit the discussion boards at www.navyseals.com and www.military.com. Several of my Teammates spend time on the NavySEALs.com site, and I regularly take part in discussions on the military.com board dedicated to the SEALs. You will find, however, that many of the participants on those discussion boards are juveniles whose ideas and abilities to express them are somewhat limited to juvenile terms and points of view. I regularly field questions like "how realistic is the SOCOM II video game?" My answer never really seems to satisfy them - "It's a video game, nothing more... enjoy it, but don't for a second buy into the fantasy that it's anything but a game on your TV/computer screen!"
So... I'll continue to answer as long as you folks ask the questions. I'll check back in later/tomorrow to see what else has popped up.
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