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  1. Kentucky Fried Chokin is offline
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    Portrait of a BJJer as a Young Man

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    Posted On:
    3/09/2009 9:31pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Need Help Figuring Out When to Lift

    So I'm training in Brazil, doing three classes (not trying to brag, I've already done plenty of that), but all this exercise leaves me with little time to lift, and I'm losing a lot of weight. I've lost at least 6kg since getting here. Part of the reason for that is my diet for the first month wasn't great. I had to eat at crappy little dinners, and I hadn't figured out how to use the right supplements.

    Since then, I've moved into somewhere with a kitchen and now prepare my own food, and I found the 'Gatorade sucks' thread here and have started to take maltodextrin and whey protein every hour, as well as BCAAS between classes.

    So, I'm not trying to gain weight here. Just maintain as much of the hard-earned muscle and strength I have as possible.

    So here's my schedule (monday-friday):
    noon-12: Get up and eat etc.
    4pm-5:30pm: First class
    6 or 6:30(I sometimes skip the warm-up)-7:30: second class
    8-9: third class
    10:eat dinner
    Saturday:
    2pm: private lesson (this is new, haven't done it yet)
    3pm: class
    Sunday: off

    I thought about working out before class, but I think that would just make me tired before class and hurt my BJJ, which is unacceptable. I thought about working out right after the last class (my academy has a gym), but I don't know if that would be effective/productive. I definatley have the energy for it. I just want to do a couple sets of squats and bench press, nothing spectacular. I would like to do a hard, weight gaining workout on Sunday, but I'm not sure it's worth sacrificing my off day.

    My recovery is excellent. I eat well, sleep well, don't drink, smoke, or do drugs, so I'm not overtraining (I know what that feels like). I've been doing this for 6 weeks, so I've gotten into a routine. I just need to add weights to that routine. So where should I fit those in?

    ---------- Post added at 06:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:21 PM ----------

    I should have mentioned that I'm an expirenced lifter (at least I think so). I've used a 5x5 method or variations of it for years now, with squats, deadlifts, and bench press.
    Last edited by Kentucky Fried Chokin; 3/09/2009 9:58pm at .
  2. partyboy is offline
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    ^ the answer to life

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    Posted On:
    3/09/2009 9:33pm


     Style: bjj/(not enough)MT

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I've found that lifting before class (mainly stronglifts) actually gets me pretty jacked. of course I crash and burn within 30 minutes after class but so far it's been worth it.
    In summation your argument denotes a lack of intellectual honesty on your part. It is my contention that this matter would best be solved with fisticuffs. I believe I will be victorious in this regard.
  3. Kentucky Fried Chokin is offline
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    Portrait of a BJJer as a Young Man

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    Posted On:
    3/09/2009 9:41pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If I crash before the second class, it's not really worth it. Sounds like a good idea if I only do one class, but I was worried that it would also increase the risk of injury.
  4. TheRuss is offline
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    is badder than you

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    Posted On:
    3/09/2009 10:39pm

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    First off, I'm going to recommend against anything resembling pre-fatiguing unless you have a for-real competition coming up shortly. I pre-fatigued with a Tabata before judo class for a while... my intent was for it to offset my size/strength advantage, but it wound up making it harder for me to execute techniques properly, probably delaying my progress. Moral of the story: do what it takes to be crisp and fresh for each class.

    Now, looking at your schedule... you've got some options.

    Lots of open time on the weekend for you to take advantage of.
    You can lift whenever you want on Sunday, or if you want to preserve Sunday as a day off, you can hit the gym Saturday after class.
    If you finish class loose and energized and then cool down and stiffen up, start lifting as soon as possible after class (after your recovery drink, that is).
    Conversely, if you're bagged after class and gradually feel better, spend some time in the sauna, contrast bath/shower, and maybe a nap before lifting.
    If you feel like junk after class and don't feel any better with time, walk through a light and short workout and call it a day. If this is happening routinely, you're probably better off lifting fresh on Sunday.

    Either way, try to keep it quite short - under one hour from pre-workout shake to post-workout shake. Reasoning here is that you're getting shitloads of physical activity already, and you don't need any more cortisol in your diet. If you're not recovering adequately between sets, you can try alternating sets (press-rest-squat-rest, press-rest-squat-rest, etc.) so you're recovering from two exercises at the same time. Works better with low-rep, high-intensity, non-overlapping exercises, and you'll need to allow a bit more total time between sets of the same exercise to catch your breath (but less time overall).

    M-F, you have basically a fixed block of classes/recovery from 1600 to 2100, so if you intend to lift more than once a week, you'll need to lift either before or after that block. I'd personally lean towards after, but it depends on your situation (does your room get brighter/noisier during daylight hours? is the gym open late? do you have other external factors to consider?). As above, keep it short, and if you're still feeling trashed after you've warmed up, keep it light and try to reschedule.

    You may be able to get in a hard workout and recovery time in the morning, or you may not. You'll have to try it. Realistically, though, given that you're not Ronnie Coleman, a heavy day on the weekend and a light day around Wednesday, combined with enough calories to run a slight surplus, should let you keep your muscle mass stable.
    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    Downstreet on the flip-flop, timepants.
  5. Kentucky Fried Chokin is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/09/2009 10:46pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Helpful as always. Thanks Russ. Tomorrow after the last class (Tuesdays and Thursdays work better because the gym is open after 9) I'll try alternating a couple sets of squats and bench.
  6. Sakmongkol is offline

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    Posted On:
    3/10/2009 2:14pm


     Style: Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If you are looking to just maintain strength then once a week of lifting would be fine. Afternoon on a saturday Say Deads, OHP, Chins alt weekly with Squat, Bench, BORS.

    If you would like to lift multiple times i.e. in the week then do as Russ says and maybe drop the volume somewhat whilst keeping intensity high i.e. 3x5 instead of 5x5 and maybe even 1x5 on exercises such as Deads which really depress the CNS.

    Thats a lot of work in the week with that amount of skill training, push up your sleep and food as much as possible.
  7. TheRuss is offline
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    is badder than you

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    Posted On:
    3/10/2009 7:45pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: None

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sakmongkol View Post
    Thats a lot of work in the week with that amount of skill training, push up your sleep and food as much as possible.
    Heh, I forgot to mention the sleep thing. Get lots of it. If you can nap during the day without feeling sluggish or having trouble getting to sleep at night, that might help too.
    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    Downstreet on the flip-flop, timepants.
  8. Kentucky Fried Chokin is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/12/2009 10:57pm

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     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ok, so on tuesday I did 2 sets of 5 of squats and bench press, doing one, resting, then doing the other. I did one work set, then reduced the weight by 20kg, and did a back off set just to ease into this. I felt really good on wednesday, and it didn't affect my training, so I did it again today. I've been eating a lot and trying to get 9 hours of sleep a night.

    I'm plan on doing a big workout sunday, and spending the rest of the day eating and sambaing. I things still feel good, I think I'll increase the volume to three sets like you get suggested.
    Last edited by Kentucky Fried Chokin; 3/12/2009 11:00pm at .
  9. Kentucky Fried Chokin is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/13/2009 11:31pm

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     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    ****, I over did it and couldn't sleep last night. I don't think I'll do anymore lifting until I get more melatonin.
  10. TheRuss is offline
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    Posted On:
    3/14/2009 12:29am

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     Style: None

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Rotten. I don't think I've had that problem (hard to say, though... sleep schedule was pretty screwy for my college years). Did you give the early-afternoon lifting a shot?
    Quote Originally Posted by Emevas View Post
    Downstreet on the flip-flop, timepants.
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