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  1. #1
    Jack Rusher's Avatar
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    Folk Wrestling and Sambo

    A cool old video showing footage of some of the wrestling styles that were assimilated in the process of creating Sambo:

    YouTube - Kurash Chidaoba Khapsagay Gulesh Trinta Sambo

    The only Kurash I could find is the new unified Kurash (as practiced in Uzbekistan), which is meant to be an international sport in which all the related grappling systems from the area can compete:

    YouTube - clip présentation du kourach (lutte d'Ouzbékistan)

    Chidaoba (Georgian folk wrestling):

    YouTube - Georgian wrestling
    YouTube - georgian wrestling

    I could find no videos of Khapsagai, the wrestling style from Yakutsk, but it looks about how you'd imagine:



    Gulesh from Azerbaijan:

    YouTube - GULESH
    (Might be Freestyle going by the old name)

    The only video of Trinta I could locate is of two drunk Moldavians at a lawn party in Italy:

    YouTube - moldoveni in italia-trinta

    Unmentioned in the video, but probably of interest, is this clip from Dagestan:

    YouTube - dagestan wrestling

    Examples of Armenian kokh were unfindable.
    Most people do not do, but take refuge in theory and talk, thinking that they will become good in this way -- Aristotle, Nicomachean Ethics, II.4

  2. #2
    TheMightyMcClaw's Avatar
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    I've not watched all the videos yet, but I'd like to comment on the Uzbek Kurash one. At first, it pretty much looked like straight-up Ippon judo, complete with rolling uchimata, but then I noticed a subtle difference; it seems like there were a LOT more hip throws were the thrower kept both feet planted (ie, o-goshi, koshi guruma, sode tsurikomi goshi) than I normally see in Judo. I feel like I almost never see judoka in highlight reels who don't have at least one foot off the ground when throwing. :P

  3. #3
    theotherserge's Avatar
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    Sambosteve has some vid of the belt-wrestling championships we saw in Moscow '07; I'll bug him to post it here.
    Many things we do naturally become difficult only when we try to make them intellectual subjects. It is possible to know so much about a subject that you become totally ignorant.
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  4. #4
    Jack Rusher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheMightyMcClaw
    it seems like there were a LOT more hip throws were the thrower kept both feet planted
    The mechanics of the Central Asian stuff always looks more shuaijiao than judo to me. Something about the power generation and style of base in sambo reminds me of shuaijiao as well, but I need to do some sambo before I'll really understand the similarities and differences.
    Most people do not do, but take refuge in theory and talk, thinking that they will become good in this way -- Aristotle, Nicomachean Ethics, II.4

  5. #5
    theotherserge's Avatar
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    it is from differences in footwork and the looser Judogi vs tighter-fit jacket/vest/no-gi

    A good analogy is in Judo you exploit the space between yourself and uki-about the size of a medicine ball-before making contact as you throw. For Sambo, you lock the uki to yourself and fling him like a useless appendage.
    Many things we do naturally become difficult only when we try to make them intellectual subjects. It is possible to know so much about a subject that you become totally ignorant.
    -Mentat Text Two (dicto)

  6. #6
    Rene "Zendokan" Gysenbergs's Avatar
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    @ theotherserge,

    Did Sambo take over the footwork of Kurdash or Judo or both when performing hip throws?

    @ Jack Rusher,

    Do Kurdash and Shuai Jiao have the same footwork for hip throws? And what are the other similarities/differences between them?

    Thanks.
    Last edited by Rene "Zendokan" Gysenbergs; 2/13/2009 5:36pm at .
    Quote Originally Posted by Jiujitsu77
    You know you are crazy about BJJ/Martial arts when...
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    ...your books on Kama Sutra and BJJ are interchangeable.
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    It looks like this is a great fighting method if someone replaces your shampoo with superglue.
    The real deadly:

  7. #7
    Jack Rusher's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zendokan
    Do Kurdash and Shuai Jiao have the same footwork for hip throws? And what are the other similarities/differences between them?
    Sadly, I've never met a Kurash player with whom to compare notes. The footwork looks familiar in the videos I've seen in part because they tend to base out while throwing rather than staying up on the toes. The best way to demonstrate what I mean is probably to show you 'pei', a shuaijiao throw that resembles Judo's seoi nage:

    YouTube - www.shuaijiao.tv Technique of the Week

    ... you can see some variations on this at around 2:00 of the Kurash video.
    Most people do not do, but take refuge in theory and talk, thinking that they will become good in this way -- Aristotle, Nicomachean Ethics, II.4

  8. #8
    theotherserge's Avatar
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    Initially, one "founder" of sambo was trained in Jiu-Jitsu and a plethora of other styles and the other primarily in Judo. Due to a political rupture, the Judoka was disappeared/made unavailable and a trend to de-Japanifacation spread from there.

    Once the Soviets decided to compete in Judo, alot of the Japanese influences came back into training.

    So it kind of depended on who you were coached by and if there are any NKVD agents watching you train... ;-)
    Many things we do naturally become difficult only when we try to make them intellectual subjects. It is possible to know so much about a subject that you become totally ignorant.
    -Mentat Text Two (dicto)

  9. #9

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    Thanks for posting, those are some cool videos. For whatever reason, I find it interesting to see the folk styles of wrestling from around the world

  10. #10
    Siniq's Avatar
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    I'l try to embed this, just in case here's the link: http://www.vbox7.com/play:964fef4a
    This is bulgarian folk wrestling and I don't think it's influenced anything. Just for the folk wrestling fans.

    <object classid="clsid:D27CDB6E-AE6D-11cf-96B8-444553540000" codebase="http://download.macromedia.com/pub/shockwave/cabs/flash/swflash.cab#version=8,0,0,0" width="450" height="403"><param name="movie" value="http://i47.vbox7.com/player/ext.swf?vid=964fef4a"><param name="quality" value="high"><embed src="http://i47.vbox7.com/player/ext.swf?vid=964fef4a" quality="high" pluginspage="http://www.macromedia.com/go/getflashplayer" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" width="450" height="403"></embed></object>

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