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  1. honest_truth is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/08/2009 1:47am


     Style: Kickboxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Lets discuss 2 of fedors moves from his book

    One is punching technique and the other is a kicking one:

    1st) LEFT HOOK:
    I throw my lead-handed hook differently than most. the majority of MMA fighters will rotate their hips, body and striking arm on a circular path all at the same time. with their striking arm looping out to the side and all parts of their body moving together in one direction. the punch is easy for their opponent to spot. landing such a strike can certainly cause damage, but it tends to produce more of a push than a crisp impact.

    to land my lead hook a larger percentage of the time and delivera more brain-jarring blow, i'll beging the punch by throwing my fist straight out, almost as if i am throwing a jab. as my fist nears the target, i will quickly snap my hips, flare my elbow out to the side, and rotate my striking hand over so that my thumb is pointing toward the mat.

    delaying the hip and arm rotation disguises the punch as a jab, making it difficult for my opponent to spot, yet still allws me to attack my target from a non linear angle. it also produces more of a whipping effect, which leads to a faster and more powerful punch.


    i can kinda see it, although he seems to hook the first leading hook.



    2nd) THE RIGHT OUTSIDE LOW KICK:
    I throw the low round kick differently than most. many thai boxers begin the kick by whipping their hips circularly, which pulls their kicking legs off the mat and allows them to make contact with the sharp bone running down the front of their shin. although this is an excellent kick that can cause a lot of damage, it will turn your back to your opponent should you miss, which in MMA makes you vulnerable to a takedown.

    to prevent this from happening, i thrust my hips forward instead of circularly. the motion of my hips pulls my leg off the ground just the same, but instead of connecting with the front of my shin, i'll connect with the inside of my shin, i've found that kicking this way is quicker, produces an ample amount of power, and allows for a speedier recovery, especially when you miss the kick.
    ====================================

    So, i am putting up those 2 moves for a discussion, kindly try them during heavy bag and sparring sessions too, and i hope after all the effort put into typing this out we could have meaningful discussion.
  2. theotherserge is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/08/2009 3:38am

    Join us... or die
     Style: sambo/crossfit

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Fedor doesn't really throw a jab/hook in the traditional sense; it is how he describes it. The action is alot like uchikomi work. The first hook hits Tim in the head so it doesn't finish the motion.

    I hate to say it, but my most recent insight into Fedor's striking style came out of a discussion about "long frame postures" in Xingyi...well, the truth shall set you free!

    *waits for IIF to chime in next* :-)
    Many things we do naturally become difficult only when we try to make them intellectual subjects. It is possible to know so much about a subject that you become totally ignorant.
    -Mentat Text Two (dicto)
  3. marcusdbrutus is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/08/2009 5:17am


     Style: MT, Judo & BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    As a huge fan, Fedor's striking style always made me nervous. Being a crazy-smart fighter it's unlikely he would try and swing with a good boxer, but if he did I think he wouldn't be too hard to slip and capitalize on.

    If he gets you with one good shot though, it ruins your day pretty damn fast.
  4. Diesel_tke is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/08/2009 9:23am

    supporting member
     Style: stick,Taiji, mountainbike

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I have his book as well. I have been experimenting with these just to see what type of impact they have on my striking. I like the punching thing but it causes a couple of problems in my opinion. If you are striking with a boxer and you throw this hook at the same time as he throws a jab, the jab should connect before the hook because is has less distance to travel then the hook does. Also, the hook seems a little more like a hey maker and opens you up a whole bunch.

    I think it is interesting but too risky. I like the traditional hook because it allows you to stay a little but more compact than Fedor's hook/jab. Fedor always makes me nervous when I see him strike. I think he can be a little more open which his punches because he has an iron jaw. But for me I think it is too risky. I only use it now, if I am being super relaxed with my style.

    I don't agree with his kick idea. I don't think his way of kicking brings enough power behind it. If you are just gonna do a half-ass kick, I would rather just no kick. That way you are not sacrificing your base. If you want to throw a hard kick, commit to it and throw it proper. I understand what he is saying about turning your back when you kick. But I think this can be drilled out if you do enough kicking in the air rather than always on the bag. If you spend enough time kicking in the air, your body learns how to react to the missed kick. You may end up in a southpaw stance, but working with this can allow you to learn some pretty good combinations off the missed kick.

    That is just my 2 cents worth. Take it for what it is.
  5. Domite is offline
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    blotter art.

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    Posted On:
    2/08/2009 9:39am


     Style: San Shou

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I agree, but he tends not to use kicks as power strikes anyway. I definetly would in MMA, so I wouldn't try to adapt it.

    The hook I dont really understand how to do, and my trainer seems pretty apathetic towards it.

    The combos he uses in his book are really cool though, he also has a move where you slip the jab as if it were a cross(other way), stuff you opponent's back hand, and do a leg kick, it's lots of fun in sparring.
  6. Diesel_tke is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/08/2009 10:13am

    supporting member
     Style: stick,Taiji, mountainbike

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Yeah, his book is awesome. I always recommend it to people I train with.
  7. billy sol hurok is offline
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    Posted On:
    2/08/2009 11:16am

    supporting member
     Style: age&treachery

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by diesel_tke
    If you are striking with a boxer and you throw this hook at the same time as he throws a jab, the jab should connect before the hook because is has less distance to travel then the hook does. Also, the hook seems a little more like a hey maker and opens you up a whole bunch.
    You can eat a jab even when you're throwing one of your own, simultaneous-like. I'd be even more worried about eating a right cross: it gets there faster (as you said), and the opponenet's right shoulder gives him cover from my left hook (if it even manages to arrive).

    IIRC, Fedor sometimes ducks his head to the right when throwing that hybrid left hook -- sort of the way Hendo ducks his head to the left when throwing his overhand right -- but not always. He kind of does it in h_t's gif.
  8. MSphinx is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/08/2009 12:04pm


     Style: Muay Thai

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    What's the name of Fedor's book? It sounds interesting.
  9. Torakaka is offline
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    Do you eat breakfast?

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    Posted On:
    2/08/2009 2:28pm

    supporting member
     Style: Kitty Pow Pow!!!

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My impression is that Fedor doesn't have a wonderful grasp on striking technique, so he's covered his particular technical failings by altering his technique. How he throws his hook obviously works, and he's a big boy that can hit hard, but it's pretty much definitely not going to have the same power or difficulty to counter/evade as a good, tight hook. How he describes "most MMA fighters" throwing their hooks is just sloppy form, and not at all a good hook. I'd call that a haymaker. Fedor has learned to throw his haymakers more sneakily, but it's still not a fantastic punch.

    Same idea with the kick really. I think Fedor has some misconceptions about the "right" way to throw a kick. Also, the idea about spinning around from missing a kick is silly to me. The failure there is not the technique of the kick, it's that you were throwing a kick when you should know better than to even try because you're simply not in range for a good thai kick. Unless someone's being stupid slow, in which case you can do whatever the hell you want, you never want to just wing a hard kick at them from "outside" range. Plus, if you don't have the control to be able to throw a kick where you turn your hips over and not spin around, you're probably not a super great kicker.

    Yes, Fedor is bad ass, but his striking technique is pretty blah as far as I'm concerned.
    Last edited by Torakaka; 2/08/2009 2:32pm at .
  10. EmetShamash is online now
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    Posted On:
    2/08/2009 3:45pm


     Style: Chinese Martial Arts

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    IIRC, Fedor himself is not very impressed with his own striking ability and is working very hard to correct it. Obviously he has plenty of other skills to make up for it in addition to his explosive strength which he can use to "muscle" strikes through.
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