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  1. HappyOldGuy is offline
    HappyOldGuy's Avatar

    Slipping coal into stockings with a little sumptin for mom.

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    Posted On:
    2/03/2009 3:13pm


     Style: Rehab Fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The problem with most BJJ/Sub rules from my perspective as a guy who likes to throw people is that throws are deemphasized too much. The ones I'm familiar with had sweep into position and throw into position score equally. My dream ruleset would still have the concept of an ippon throw. It would just use somewhat different/stricter criteria.

    Also, my dream rules penalize butt flopping with public flogging.
    Last edited by HappyOldGuy; 2/03/2009 3:15pm at .
  2. Just Guess is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    2/03/2009 3:16pm


     Style: ukemi & tapping out

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark
    Doesn't NAGA gi rules already do what Fiction Pimp just said. Throws only count if you land in a dominate position. Subs are encouraged and you can even do some leg locks that Strict BJJ forbids.
    From a Judo perspective the problem with NAGA rules is that all takedowns are worth only 2 points, but in reality not all takedowns and throws are created equal.
  3. ZenOfAnger is offline
    ZenOfAnger's Avatar

    Senior Member

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    St. louis, MO
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    Posted On:
    2/03/2009 3:42pm


     Style: Judo+soon 2b bjj,boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I recently visited a judo school to watch a class (not participate, was feeling sick) to consider whether or not it was a school I might have interest in.

    During newaza training, the instructor reminded everyone that their was a new rule change when you had someone in a pin. If I remember correctly, he said that you could no longer keep your head down while you had a pin (chin tucked into chest, looking at your partners body, I guess), and that it had to be up, that is, no longer looking at the guy you are pinning, but past him, like the wall behind him.


    Being a judo newb, I'm not sure what effect this is supposed to have on the game, but does this make it harder to get pins, or did I just hear him incorrectly about the whole thing? Does this have something to do with jigotai, or whatever that is? I was wondering what the effect of this rule will have on the newaza aspect of judo, and also on the overall game.

    Just curious if judo is heading down the wrong path by adding rules in order to serve a misconception that judo should be and stay like it was in the late 1800's, as mentioned above, or if it is just doing its best to distinguish itself from other grappling arts, and is just changing the rules to make it more modern?

    I think if it does go back to how it was in the "18th century", it will eventually lose much of its application and respect, and will slowly become one of they many TMAs where there are kata and one-steps aplenty, without the pressure-testing of randori.

    I hope this is not the case.
  4. Mtripp is offline
    Mtripp's Avatar

    Choked out by Gene Lebell

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    Grand Blanc, MI
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    Posted On:
    2/03/2009 3:52pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    This is why I think Sambo is the way to go, and why I have no interest. Not in judo asits done now.
  5. ruptureclothing is offline

    Lightweight

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    Dec 2008
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    394

    Posted On:
    2/03/2009 3:52pm

    Business Class Supporting Member
     Rupture Clothing: American Made MMA Gear and Apparel Style: Judo and BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I think removing Koka sucks. I fought in a Judo tourney about a month ago and the refs spent about an hour going over the new rules. To add - at least at this tournament - uniform restrictions are being enforced with an iron fist. They made me cut my belt because it was too long.
  6. Just Guess is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    2/03/2009 3:56pm


     Style: ukemi & tapping out

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by ZenOfAnger
    During newaza training, the instructor reminded everyone that their was a new rule change when you had someone in a pin. If I remember correctly, he said that you could no longer keep your head down while you had a pin (chin tucked into chest, looking at your partners body, I guess), and that it had to be up, that is, no longer looking at the guy you are pinning, but past him, like the wall behind him.
    What? I can't find that anywhere. I think that instructor must have must have misinterpreted the rule changes somehow with incredibly bizarre logic.
  7. Blue Negation is offline

    Woke up in the mortuary

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    Aug 2006
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    Ohio
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    Posted On:
    2/03/2009 3:58pm


     Style: Judo, Sub wrestling

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by 1point2
    I'm both happy (at my within-the-rules improvement) and sad (at my training-to-the-test) about my improved turtling and chest-diving out of falls in my second judo tournament (see my competition footage).

    SAMBO does a good job of focusing on throws while keeping groundwork. Their point system incorporates submission, throws to neutral positions, throws to dominant positions, and perfect throws (where I remain standing). The SAMBO ruleset is really ideal for a lot of things.
    Problems with sport Sambo:

    1)no chokes (lolwut?)
    2)no twisting locks: ude garami/kimura/americana/omoplata, toeholds, heelhooks
    3)silly shorts

    Freestyle sambo corrects most of these problems but sadly doesn't have an Ippon/Total Victory, narrowly missing perfection.


    I don't really mind the rules. Notice that it doesn't say you can't do singles/doubles etc, you just can't stay bent over and defensive and you can't use pant grabs to help a crappy shot.
  8. ZenOfAnger is offline
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    Senior Member

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    St. louis, MO
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    Posted On:
    2/03/2009 4:03pm


     Style: Judo+soon 2b bjj,boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Just Guess
    What? I can't find that anywhere. I think that instructor must have must have misinterpreted the rule changes somehow with incredibly bizarre logic.

    Well, the instructor was blind (no joke). I just wanted to mention it, because I was not sure if I had misheard him, and that he was actually talking about another rule and I am just too much of a newb to understand what he said correctly. If anyone does know of a rule change that does say something about head position during a pin, I'd like to know.
  9. El Neko is offline
    El Neko's Avatar

    "Yes Neko, please keep telling me more about your manly collection of Star Wars audiobooks"

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    Nov 2005
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    Boca Raton
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    Posted On:
    2/03/2009 4:21pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Negation
    I don't really mind the rules. Notice that it doesn't say you can't do singles/doubles etc, ...
    Actually there was something regarding doubles, you have to do it with proper kuzushi, no more just shooting for the legs and hope the person trips
    Quote Originally Posted by Phrost View Post
    Yeah, you're probably right.

    But still, something about having a black guy or a lesbian jump out from behind a garbage can yelling "SURPRISE GONG SAU" at any of your big-named RBSD kooks makes me giggle like a little girl.
    Quote Originally Posted by Phrost
    There are two kinds of members on MAP:

    1. LARPers/Partial Artists
    2. People who haven't heard about Bullshido.
    The Mighty McClaw to Fox when refusing to fight AnnaT.

    Quote Originally Posted by TheMightyMcClaw
    Don't fight girls? When are you living, the 1850's? I suppose you think they shouldn't work or vote either.
    Get with the times and punch a chick.
    Wingchundo's response after I called him a "*****"

    Quote Originally Posted by wingchundo View Post
    Hey, I resemble that remark!

    Ok, time for a snappy comeback.... uh...

    OK. Here goes.

    You are what you eat!
  10. ruptureclothing is offline

    Lightweight

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    Dec 2008
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    394

    Posted On:
    2/03/2009 4:32pm

    Business Class Supporting Member
     Rupture Clothing: American Made MMA Gear and Apparel Style: Judo and BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by El Neko
    Actually there was something regarding doubles, you have to do it with proper kuzushi, no more just shooting for the legs and hope the person trips
    You sure? There was nothing mentioned about single or double leg takedowns. I actually saw a couple, one for Ippon.
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