Thread: Economically sustainable Judo
1/15/2009 1:53pm, #11Originally Posted by jnp
I think that judo shouldn't be represented as a bargain-basement second-best to BJJ. Maybe that perception is affecting the marketability of judo.
I agree that judo should definitely be recommended as an art to newbs, but there is so much more to commend it than just "cheap and easy to get".Where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence.
1/15/2009 1:55pm, #12
Originally Posted by ignatzami
- Join Date
- Apr 2008
- Midwestern Hell
1/15/2009 2:04pm, #13Originally Posted by sochin101
I was debating this, as it is a discussion point between Sochin and I often have.
I found out recently that my dad took Judo as a younger man and it just blew my mind. He was a football player and boxing fan....what the **** was HE doing training in a martial art???
Really, people stepping in to the gym/studio/dojo/dojang/kwoon have different fears. Some don't want to get hit in the face.
Perhaps the wording could be "it is a good beginner art that allows as steep a learning curve as you like that has a strong, long-standing root in the US."
Work up a nice tidy respectful discussion point of Judo and who it would be good for and what the core tenant of Judo is: The Gentle Art.
For crying out loud, the most manly of all US Presidents, Teddy Roosevelt BUILT A DOJO AT THE WHITEHOUSE SO HE COULD PLAY JUDO!
1/15/2009 2:05pm, #14
Originally Posted by ignatzami
- Join Date
- May 2008
- Flint, Mi.
Maybe if I get a club started I can hit the anime club in hopes they see it as a cultural opportunity.
1/15/2009 2:25pm, #15
I'm hesitant to be the one who brings this up. Since I'm a semi newb who actually pays for his judo (it's offered as an "elective" at the MMA gym I train at). But AFAIK the notion of Judo as a "not for profit" enterprise is pretty intentional on the part of one Jigaro Kano. I'm not saying it's the right approach here and now, but it does seem pretty embedded into the whole culture.
Also, my coaches and others, maybe including Josh? are making (some) money by teaming up with striking and/or BJJ teachers to open MMA gyms.
1/15/2009 2:37pm, #16
oishi-sensei in new york city has been running a highly successful dojo for years. he charges a LOT of money (last time i heard it was $25/class unless you paid for a whole year and even then the price didn't come down much.) part of this is due to location, as he is in one of the most expensive areas in manhattan.
the fact that he's 7th dan from the kodokan and also was a wrestling champ in japan doesn't hurt, but i think it should be shown that running a sustainable judo dojo can be done.
not to sound like a big-city elitist, but could part of the problem be location?"Face punches are an essential character building part of a martial art. You don't truly love your children unless you allow them to get punched in the face." - chi-conspiricy
"When I was a little boy, I had a sailor suit, but it didn't mean I was in the Navy." - Mtripp on the subject of a 5 year old karate black belt
"Without actual qualifications to be a Zen teacher, your instructor is just another roundeye raping Asian culture for a buck." - Errant108
"Seriously, who gives a **** what you or Errant think? You're Asian males, everyone just ignores you, unless you're in a krotty movie." - new2bjj
1/15/2009 2:41pm, #17
Thanks this is the kind of discussion that is needed. I can tell you right now Judo will not change. The people teaching Judo will not change. The schools will not change and the methodology will not change.
I have found that out over the past 5 years trying to make a viable club. I have my son and one guy that have been with me since I started out on my own. He is a good friend now and doesn't pay a cent to train. This is one problem that I have I don't like taking money from my friends. Training as much as we do that's what we become.
This best thing that you can do to market Judo is get into an MMA/BJJ club and have them pay you. Take the gi off and teach Judo with no gi. Teach classes at the gym devoted to Judo to supplement their BJJ. Take them to tournaments and get them involved in the scene.
Teaching just Judo these days isn't going to cut it. If Tim had not opened Gladiators this year I was going to open a full time gym and make a run at it. Fortunately for me the gym opened and I have a place to teach and people to train. I am not in charge of book keeping so its a great fit. I wasn't going to teach just Judo and I was going to do contracts and electronic withdrawal. These 2 things are needed in order for you to maintain your school.
I have had a value assessment done by a friend of mine. Basically I am worth about $80 an hour if I was a personal trainer. I make a quarter of that at my real job and a tenth of that when I teach martial arts. Lloyd Irvin and Radi Ferguson have the right idea when it comes to marketing and making people pay. They are looked down upon by some of the Judo community because of that. Personally I am looking at them to follow when it comes to business.
Judo at one time was progressive and innovative. The coaches were some of the best people on the planet. In the 70s US Judo started to fall and has not recovered since then. Only through MMA has Judo had a recent influx of interest. The problem is that Judo is no longer progressive. It is stagnant and unyielding now. Very few people are reaching across the spectrum, Camirillo and Ferguson are the two better known and one day me.Judo is only gentle for the guy on top.
1/15/2009 2:54pm, #18
Originally Posted by Mr.Tripp
- Join Date
- Feb 2008
How do you compete with Aerobics, Pilates or TKD or Jazzercise? Taping mats is hard work and you lose off of the hour by doing it every class. Plus you get bumped for weddings and exams.
Perhaps it is what the notion that the term 'club' brings.
1/15/2009 3:11pm, #19Originally Posted by Coach Josh
I am going to slightly disagree in that I don't think you need to take the gi off.
There's alot of people like me who tried the MMA training thing (for a bit) and decided I liked the gi based BJJ competition the best and as such Judo gi training works just fine.
The only issue judo needs to address is the higher % of injury ever since I got my sternum cracked from the stupid no-gi tai otoshi variation a year ago I have been a scardy cat but flopping guard pulling wimp.
Judo to be relevant in todays BJJ obsessed area needs more Newaza which is closer to pre Olympic judo anyways
And Also I believe Mr. Tripp Trained Dan Sveren for his second UFC so he has MMA and UFC training experience.
How in the hell there isn't a local MMA BJJ club that doesn't offer him a contract or something is bizarre.
Again maybe it's location for him.
1/15/2009 3:26pm, #20