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  1. yomitche is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/02/2009 11:48am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: escrima

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thanks for the input! I understood that DeThouars had a "vision" about Bukti Negara. Interesting...
  2. Jim_Jude is offline
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    Posted On:
    1/02/2009 6:00pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: StrikeyGrappling & WW2-fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by yomitche
    Thanks for the input! I understood that DeThouars had a "vision" about Bukti Negara. Interesting...
    Yeah, I guess that may be what they're saying now. Of course, "Vision" doesn't sound nearly as imaginary as "Dream", does it? :eusa_snoo
    "Judo is a study of techniques with which you may kill if you wish to kill, injure if you wish to injure, subdue if you wish to subdue, and, when attacked, defend yourself" - Jigoro Kano (1889)
    ***Was this quote "taken out of context"?***

    "The judoist has no time to allow himself a margin for error, especially in a situation upon which his or another person's very life depends...."
    ~ The Secret of Judo (Jiichi Watanabe & Lindy Avakian), p.19

    "Hope is not a method... nor is enthusiasm."
    ~ Brigadier General Gordon Toney
  3. shenbitt is offline

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    Posted On:
    2/20/2009 10:54am


     Style: Kaju, FMA, Judo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It is also worth remembering that silat developed it's deep long stances because of the natives fighting in a muddy jungle. Personally for short term effectiveness I would go with Muay Thai. If you were looking for something long term I might go towards the silat though I personally have not liked most of the silat I have seen up close.

    Shenbitt
  4. Jonnytko is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/08/2009 6:31am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Indo/Fma/MMA combo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    If ive learned something in my time training (and sparring against) in different martial arts is that any of the many styles can effectively be adapted to mma or simply to acomedate its effectiveness at anytime against any opponent. The flaw with most martial arts both traditional and modern (and yes im also talking about sports mma) is that there ego plays a huge role in the practicioner/teacher's failure, they are sucked into the thought that their art is the most effective or ultimate form because just by chance or by personal skill, just so happens to be stopping other styles left and right or just the fact that they dont have alot of field experience and have probly never had alot if not any contact with a different form of martial arts (or never been in any real fight or just constant sparring with the same style of fighting)...a good and effective practicioner/instructor you must understand the mechanics of all aspects of fighting (grappling,striking,throws,joint manilpulation, chokes, kicking, etc.) and reasons why you need to field test your arts is to prove their validity not just to non-believers but to yourself as well, or how else will you know if it works. Now the mentality of most combat arts, and sports arts is that, silat, kung fu, aikido, etc, feel that what they learn is too harsh for sports mma or by their moral obigations refuse to subject themselves to something they need to experience and to a sense that is true and have a good point but their is so much in these arts that is applicable they can use. The problem with silat is that its solely purely for combat ...but if you really look close (particularly styles like bukti negara and walisongo) its basically modernized jujitsu and has an abundance of grappling submission and even striking applications. Problem with mma guys is that alot of them get their asses handed to them in the cage for that very same reason, they learn an armbar, triangle choke, knock out a few guys and they think they can fight and are done with having to learn nething else, (lack of openmindedness on both ends) ...that is not martial arts people. Anyone can get choke or knock someone out but look at guys like Marcello Garcia (amazing fucking grappler) or anderson silva (great frieking striker) these guys not only kick ass but they do it with finess like in anime n ****, this show you how how being open minded and truely understanding how what you train in adapts to anyone and any situation ...even lyoto machida is wooping on people with kyokushin karate KYOKUSHIN BASTARDS!! (yeah i know he does bjj n muay thai also, dont look like it though, know why ?? cause he aint using it just probly learned it to adapt karate to mma) Lyoto is a perfect example of how you can take bukti negara and if you go out get pumbled and keep coming back to the drawing board and understand the princples of how combat works you can own even with REX KWAN DO ..and yeah ive studied bukti negara and it is a very complete art, but only effective with the right instructor, and the right mind set can . I tell you bukti n the silat ive practiced has highly improved my grappling and ground striking (off of different angles n both from the guard and on your back) not to mention their transitions from standing to take downs is off the hook!!, elbows and traps are good too which bukiti has and has done wonders for my muay thai...but in all honesty you need to understand (i dont mean become a master of or spend years learning i) combat as a whole but you need to go out and use what you know and see how well it fairs off against other arts, if it happens that you get licked than go back to the drawing board (with and open mind and willing to expand your arsenal) and make it better, figure out how you can adapt you fma,karate,silat whatever, to achieve you goal...and bukti is great, but you need to get your butt to monrovia Cali and go to the source itself, trust me, you can say bukti was created to keep women away or as a pre-lim to serak but these guys no whats up, ive learned their principles in a short amount of time by simple comparison of my previous MA training ... just gotta play with it a bit and nothing is far from your grasp ...its not until someone decides to adapt silat effectively to mma that you will see its true effectiveness ...hope i can one of the first achieve that lol (unless someone has already done it already)... Not saying silat is godly either i will say in my opinion its up their ...

    "their is no one ultimate truth, walking on the many paths of life may bring fear but do not become discouraged if at first you do not find what you are seeking, for this misfortune will teach you where to go next at the fork in the road"

    "ME lol"
    Last edited by Jonnytko; 4/08/2009 7:04am at .
  5. JBDzn is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/05/2009 12:53am

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: JKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I've trained in Bukti Negara for over 10 years along with Muay Thai, FMA, JKD, BJJ and Mixed Grappling. The end result for me is that in the street I'm definitely using my Silat because it addresses multiple opponents, edged and flexible weapons and extreme inside fighting. When sparring I've found that the leverage and throws work well and can be set up using tools from my other arts. Because of having cross-trained I know that you will use what you have trained in independent of style. Ring and street situations call for different mind sets. The quickest way to a beat down is to take the wrong mindset with you into street situation. Ask any LEO if they have the time to roll around on a glass-strewn sidewalk trying submit a knife wielding perp while a group of bystanders mull over which one of them gets to kick your head in first. The strikes of Muay Thai are very effective provided the terrain lends itself to kicking. I received direct instruction from Pendakar Paul DeThouars during the 1990s. He could make the material work and my butt was thrown all over the place "pressure testing" the material I was being taught. If you can't be taught by a direct student of Pendakar Paul then stick to arts with a shorter learning curve. I've been fortunate in that I've continued to train in Bukti Negara under one of Pendakar Paul's direct students here on the East Coast. I still train in Muay Thai under Ajarn Chai as the TBA approach is effective in both sport and self-defense situations. Silat is a good art. To make it work you need a good instructor and you have to put in the time as it is not that "transparent" in its teaching methodology.
  6. Mahendra99 is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/11/2009 11:24pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: BJJ (noob), BBT (Hiatus)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    Bone of linguistic contention.....

    Sorry for the slight necro.....

    Good info, always wondered bout some o the training Id seen in Indo.....just one of topic thing, as a non-native speaker of the language I hate to see Indonesian get bastardised, so it would be 'pendEkar' as opposed to 'pendAkar'. Wouldnt have noticed normally but it was said twice.

    BTW, not trying to sound like an arrogant arse, but if your one o the ones out there thats put effort into learning a foreign language to a high level, you'll probably understand.

    Happy training.
    Last edited by Mahendra99; 6/11/2009 11:26pm at . Reason: title time!
  7. Jim_Jude is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/12/2009 2:38am

    Join us... or die
     Style: StrikeyGrappling & WW2-fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mahendra99 View Post
    Sorry for the slight necro.....

    Good info, always wondered bout some o the training Id seen in Indo.....just one of topic thing, as a non-native speaker of the language I hate to see Indonesian get bastardised, so it would be 'pendEkar' as opposed to 'pendAkar'. Wouldnt have noticed normally but it was said twice.

    BTW, not trying to sound like an arrogant arse, but if your one o the ones out there thats put effort into learning a foreign language to a high level, you'll probably understand.

    Happy training.
    Not to mention that 95% of the Silat folks calling themselves "PendEkar" aren't even Muslim so the name definitely doesn't apply.... its amazing how people love using words they don't know the meaning of.
    "Judo is a study of techniques with which you may kill if you wish to kill, injure if you wish to injure, subdue if you wish to subdue, and, when attacked, defend yourself" - Jigoro Kano (1889)
    ***Was this quote "taken out of context"?***

    "The judoist has no time to allow himself a margin for error, especially in a situation upon which his or another person's very life depends...."
    ~ The Secret of Judo (Jiichi Watanabe & Lindy Avakian), p.19

    "Hope is not a method... nor is enthusiasm."
    ~ Brigadier General Gordon Toney
  8. Mahendra99 is offline

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    Posted On:
    6/14/2009 9:57pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: BJJ (noob), BBT (Hiatus)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    this is true..... infidels that murder my second language!!! Not that Im Muslim.... Its a bit of a mistake to equate Arabic derived words in Indonesian with Islam. There is little to no Islamic connection with the way the word is used in modern Indonesia as far as Ive come across.

    Does your silat instructor encourage learning Indonesian? It seems that most people that are training in Indo silat dont ever attempt to learn it.
  9. Jim_Jude is offline
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    Posted On:
    6/14/2009 10:58pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: StrikeyGrappling & WW2-fu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Mahendra99 View Post
    this is true..... infidels that murder my second language!!! Not that Im Muslim.... Its a bit of a mistake to equate Arabic derived words in Indonesian with Islam. There is little to no Islamic connection with the way the word is used in modern Indonesia as far as Ive come across.

    Does your silat instructor encourage learning Indonesian? It seems that most people that are training in Indo silat dont ever attempt to learn it.
    We're always learning new words & terms but he doesn't really go in for all of the Adat and Hormat that so many of these "Pendekars" go in for, creating almost a cult-like environment, it's a huge distraction.
    Yeah, my teacher's definitely no fan of that. He figures if I train hard and get the art down, that's all the respect that needs to happen. Not that it matters, because he gets plenty of respect regardless!
    "Judo is a study of techniques with which you may kill if you wish to kill, injure if you wish to injure, subdue if you wish to subdue, and, when attacked, defend yourself" - Jigoro Kano (1889)
    ***Was this quote "taken out of context"?***

    "The judoist has no time to allow himself a margin for error, especially in a situation upon which his or another person's very life depends...."
    ~ The Secret of Judo (Jiichi Watanabe & Lindy Avakian), p.19

    "Hope is not a method... nor is enthusiasm."
    ~ Brigadier General Gordon Toney
  10. selfcritical is offline

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    austin, tx
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    Posted On:
    6/15/2009 12:27am


     Style: Pekiti, ARMA, other stuff

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I was under the impression that the majority of silat instructors WERE muslim, at least the immigrant ones. I know the Suwanda's are, and a number of the malay styles aren't supposed to be taught at all to infidels.
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