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  1. Wounded Ronin is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/12/2008 7:59pm

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     Style: German longsword, .45 ACP

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!

    I saw cops with shotguns arresting someone the other day

    So, the other day, here in Las Vegas, I'm driving down Charleston, and I guess I must be somewhere between 6th and 15th street. A cop car comes tearing down the street so I get out of the way and then continue driving. When I'm stopped at a light, over to my left, I can see Metro arresting a dude with dreadlocks and a red sweatshirt at a gas station.

    I'm not an expert in firearms and related tactics but the cops seemed to be doing a good job because they had two officers covering the suspect and and someone else to go and apply handcuffs. The two cops were covering the suspect with compact shotguns (I believe they resembled or were Mossberg cruisers.) but they also had their fingers off the trigger. The suspect has his hands up and was getting down, and then a cop with a handgun approached and cuffed him.

    Just a thought, though, and maybe some of you here can give me an answer. Suppose that suddenly the suspect decided to get up and attack the cop coming to cuff him. How would the backup guys with the shotguns be able to shoot the suspet without endangering the officer going to use the handcuffs?

    After the suspect was cuffed, a cop went up to check the suspect's vehicle presumably to see if there were any occupants. I noticed that when he went to look in through the rear windows he used a sort of collapsed isoceles grip on his handgun so that he could have his face relatively close to the glass while still pointing the handgun at whatever he was looking at. Then he suddenly looked relaxed and walked away so I guess nobody was in the vehicle.

    All in all it was a pretty cool thing to see.
    Best Vietnam War music video I've ever seen put together by a vet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDY8raKsdfg
  2. Ka-Bar is offline
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    is a Godd*mn Federale!

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    Posted On:
    12/12/2008 9:48pm

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     Style: Clinchology: Judo & MT

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Wounded Ronin
    So, the other day, here in Las Vegas, I'm driving down Charleston, and I guess I must be somewhere between 6th and 15th street. A cop car comes tearing down the street so I get out of the way and then continue driving. When I'm stopped at a light, over to my left, I can see Metro arresting a dude with dreadlocks and a red sweatshirt at a gas station.

    I'm not an expert in firearms and related tactics but the cops seemed to be doing a good job because they had two officers covering the suspect and and someone else to go and apply handcuffs. The two cops were covering the suspect with compact shotguns (I believe they resembled or were Mossberg cruisers.) but they also had their fingers off the trigger. The suspect has his hands up and was getting down, and then a cop with a handgun approached and cuffed him.

    Just a thought, though, and maybe some of you here can give me an answer. Suppose that suddenly the suspect decided to get up and attack the cop coming to cuff him. How would the backup guys with the shotguns be able to shoot the suspet without endangering the officer going to use the handcuffs?

    After the suspect was cuffed, a cop went up to check the suspect's vehicle presumably to see if there were any occupants. I noticed that when he went to look in through the rear windows he used a sort of collapsed isoceles grip on his handgun so that he could have his face relatively close to the glass while still pointing the handgun at whatever he was looking at. Then he suddenly looked relaxed and walked away so I guess nobody was in the vehicle.

    All in all it was a pretty cool thing to see.
    Quick answer: slugs. A lot of cops carry shotties loaded with alternating slugs and buckshot shells.

    Rudy Reyes > Bear Grylls
  3. Devil is offline
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    His heart was visible, and the dismal sack that maketh excrement of what is eaten.

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    Posted On:
    12/12/2008 11:57pm

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    How far away from the suspect were the cops with the shotguns? I'm guessing pretty close, which would be no problem. The shot pattern is tight for the first few yards, even with a shorter barrel. They would have to be aware of where they were shooting anyway. Allowing a couple more inches for the shot spread is no big deal.

    Plus, an added advantage of shotguns is that if the suspect struggles, you can smash him in the face with the butt of the weapon. BONUS!
  4. mrm1775 is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/13/2008 3:52am


     Style: This and that

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Ka-Bar
    Quick answer: slugs. A lot of cops carry shotties loaded with alternating slugs and buckshot shells.
    What he said. With slugs a shotgun will shoot almost exactly like a rifle at shorter ranges.

    Still, I would prefer to have a rifle in that situation. In fact, I would opt for a rifle in almost all situations.
    I'm not giving you my opinion, I'm telling you how it is.
    Can't decide which evil black rifle to buy? My thoughts.
  5. Snake Plissken is offline
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    When I Get Back

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    Posted On:
    12/13/2008 8:25am

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    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Also depending on distance:

    shotgun butt to the T-Zone.

    I would hope they would remember they were in a gas station, too.
  6. JudOWNED is offline
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    北斗十字固拳

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    Posted On:
    12/13/2008 10:25am

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     Style: Judo

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    They coulda been using bean bags too, if the subject was not armed with a firearm.
  7. Wounded Ronin is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/13/2008 7:46pm

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     Style: German longsword, .45 ACP

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by devil
    How far away from the suspect were the cops with the shotguns? I'm guessing pretty close, which would be no problem. The shot pattern is tight for the first few yards, even with a shorter barrel. They would have to be aware of where they were shooting anyway. Allowing a couple more inches for the shot spread is no big deal.

    Plus, an added advantage of shotguns is that if the suspect struggles, you can smash him in the face with the butt of the weapon. BONUS!
    IIRC maybe like 15 feet or so.
    Best Vietnam War music video I've ever seen put together by a vet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDY8raKsdfg
  8. Colby is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/13/2008 9:27pm


     Style: Monkey-See-Monkey-Do

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I used to do a lot of CQB training with a shortened Remington 870. The front guy had the shield, and the rest of the guys usually alternated with shotgun / .357. I would certainly prefer a shotgun at close range. After about 50-ft though, a rifle might be better. However, you can pull off some much longer shots with a slug...
  9. Lord Skeletor is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/14/2008 10:29pm

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     Style: BJJ

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Shotguns with buckshot are totally cool inside 10 yards. Figure a 1 inch per yard spread with standard, 9-pellet buckshot. Hostage shots can easily be taken with buckshot inside 6-7 yards with a shotgun...we're using the Federal "FliteControl" buckshot and that gets amazing control on buckshot dispersion. We have shotguns that get a buckshot spread around 8-10 inches at 25 yards! That--compared with over 2 FEET for traditional buckshot at the same range.
  10. Wounded Ronin is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/14/2008 10:38pm

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     Style: German longsword, .45 ACP

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Wow! That's really good to know.
    Best Vietnam War music video I've ever seen put together by a vet: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oDY8raKsdfg
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