Body triangle vs hooks for back mount
I am tall enough at close to 6 "2" to have legs long enough to body lock people. This is something I am starting to experiment with.
On Thursday I took someones back got my hooks in and the over under, as they went to the side I locked my right leg under my left knee and locked them in tight as I tried to get my arm in under their chin.
The guy then rolled to his right and went back to his stomach, I kept the body triangle on however I didn't like the feeling the rolling movement put on my right knee and the self inflicted pressure when he went back to his stomach and went back to hooks in (and eventually finished)
The Purple belts teaching the class (who just came in 2nd at the pan ams so hes damn good) said he doesn't like the body triangle but that is more a hight thing with him as he's about a 8-9 inches shorter.
So I have two questions for the grappling brain trust here.
Do you prefer hooks or the body triangle, if so why?
And from a technical standpoint reading what I did was there a mistake or something I missed so I don't feel self inflicted pressure on my knee?
I'm 6'5 and not very comfortable attacking / controlling from the back (I always feel like I'm riding too high), but I wanted to pass on my observations in case they are of benefit:
1) I made the mistake early on of either leaving my extended leg in or not paying attention while my opponent got it back in for a leg attack
2) I do like the control of the body triangle but it obviously limits attacks
3) I REALLY like using it late in a match when my opponent is tired as it affects their breathing and forces their hand. I've often had to switch back to a more open rear mount to finish however (to be fair I really like the bow /arrow choke and armbars from the back)
I'll pay more attention in training and see if I can get you some more detailed feedback. For the record, I'm a blue belt so I'm certainly no expert.
If he starts rolling when you have the body triangle on, squeeze him tight to you with your over/unders and switch your body triangle to the other side to avoid the leg pressure. If he's smart he can leglock you if you don't switch it.
Originally Posted by Goju - Joe
Normally you want to keep him from rolling when you have the body triangle because it means you have to adjust to avoid the leglock.
I prefer the hooks to the body triangle because my legs are not long and I want to keep more options than it gives me.
Went over this on Saturday. You have to switch the sides of the lock quickly. If you get rolled over on the side you have the lock on, you can break your own ankle. It helps to drill the switch quite a bit.
Hooks are a much safer option, but I still like the triangle for that nasty squeeze.
Its not "right" or "wrong" to choose body triangle over hooks, you simply need to understand the pros and cons of choosing one over the other.
Body triangle is very good for attacking with a RNC. Because of the tight control that it offers (if you know how to hold it) you can actually free up both of your hands to attack with a choke while still maintaining strong positional control. Unfortunately you dont have many other options besides choking.
Hooks isnt as tight as is a body triangle, but you're much more mobile when attacking. You have options as far as attacking armbars and sliding out to the side to increase your leverage for collar chokes. Your opponent may even be more likely to try to reach down and pry a hook off in an escape attempt, which makes for an excellent time to attack.
That being said, my personal preference is hooks when training gi (since I'll usually grab a collar and slide out to the side- I want the extra mobility) and body triangle when training no gi/MMA.
This isnt set in stone- I'll switch depending on the situation. Once again, you're not making a right or wrong choice here.
This is what I do to people that use the body triangle on me. There's a purple belt at my gym who's very good at it, and ca switch from side to side as I roll, trying to trap his leg. But most people aren't that good, and I have strong hips and abs, which I've used to pop someone's ankle with.
Originally Posted by indy007
I personally like cross the feet behind the hip. You get one hook in but the other goes around his hip and you lock your feet between his crotch, its behind him though and you can't get foot locked.
I have foot locked people who go for the body triangle.
If it hurts to roll over with the body triangle you either haven't sunk it properly or aren't holding it properly.
Where are you putting your leg you've got going down on the triangle (versus the one across the body)?
My post applies to getting footlocked while doing a body triangle too.
If that happens, it is set wrong.
If you have a rpoper body triangle, your exposed foot should be behind their thigh. If you put in front of them (or they move it in front) then you can get a foot lock similar to the one when a person crosses their feet with both hooks is.
I agree with Upa though, if your feeling pressure on your knee in the body triangle, chances are your just doing it wrong.