So, would anyone be interested in learning Judo from Vladimir Putin

**MrBadGuy** · Posted On: 10/13/2008 6:28pm

Cool from a distance, at least. I don't want to be hipthrown into poison vats. Laws no!

**sammywhip** · Posted On: 10/13/2008 6:52pm

Originally Posted by f4n4n

Wait, are you blaming torture and imprisonment? You know there is this strange army base, apparently in CUBA (the US are sort of cool with this country, ranting space from them and such) it is called Guantanamo and I have heard that there are people held since 2001, which makes this 7 years, without a trial, without any rights, sleep deprived, water boarded... and I know of at least ONE who was KIDNAPPED (yes you read that right) out of a free European country and held there for 4 years.

Haha oh my god dude. Bringing up Guantanamo is sooo pathetic!!! They are treated like fucking royalty there. Seriously, fucking royalty. I'm not a big fan of Bush.... I do support finishing in Iraq, because otherwise we'll end up having it like Afghanistan is now because we left there too early. (Which Obama bitches about all the time, and that contradicts him wanting to leave Iraq now but he's dumb as **** so whatever.) But no, Bush has done bad things, Patriot Act is terrible.... but I bet your a liberal so you should love that big government bullshit..... Anyway, what we have right now, with our problems, is a completely useless Democratic controlled Congress. And, Obama is like the rest of them. How is he a "change" candidate when he seriously has voted party on everything. He is so ineffective its actually quite humorous. I love people all about change supporting him, cause uh, he doesn't do ANYTHING! But come on man, Guantanamo? You can do better....

**CrackFox** · Posted On: 10/13/2008 7:26pm

Jesus wept.

F4n4n, this is what happens when you bring irrelevant **** into a discussion. That previous post is all your fault.

**TheMightyMcClaw** · Posted On: 10/13/2008 7:39pm

Originally Posted by sammywhip

Haha oh my god dude. Bringing up Guantanamo is sooo pathetic!!! They are treated like fucking royalty there. Seriously, fucking royalty. I'm not a big fan of Bush.... I do support finishing in Iraq, because otherwise we'll end up having it like Afghanistan is now because we left there too early. (Which Obama bitches about all the time, and that contradicts him wanting to leave Iraq now but he's dumb as **** so whatever.) But no, Bush has done bad things, Patriot Act is terrible.... but I bet your a liberal so you should love that big government bullshit..... Anyway, what we have right now, with our problems, is a completely useless Democratic controlled Congress. And, Obama is like the rest of them. How is he a "change" candidate when he seriously has voted party on everything. He is so ineffective its actually quite humorous. I love people all about change supporting him, cause uh, he doesn't do ANYTHING! But come on man, Guantanamo? You can do better....

Your position certainly is well-thought out, clearly expressed, and very well-cited to boot. I can't disagree with you on any point.

**Cy Q. Faunce** · Posted On: 10/13/2008 8:47pm

Originally Posted by sammywhip

Haha oh my god dude. Bringing up Guantanamo is sooo pathetic!!! They are treated like fucking royalty there. Seriously, fucking royalty.

Well...there was that duke who was drowned in a vat of wine. I guess that's kind of like waterboarding. And Ivar inn beinlausi had a thing for killing kings in creative ways.

So, sure. Royalty.

**Eddie Hardon** · Posted On: 10/14/2008 5:59am

Originally Posted by Cy Q. Faunce

Well...there was that duke who was drowned in a vat of wine. I guess that's kind of like waterboarding. And Ivar inn beinlausi had a thing for killing kings in creative ways.

So, sure. Royalty.

Nice post and explains the origin of the Pub name "The Duke of Clarence". Yes, really.

King Vlad? A dangerous man who has clearly advocated political assassination (the polonium was a nice ref).

Dubya? Good Lord. Walking out of a Govt office here in ole Londinium, I overheard some senior officers talking about him and could not restrain myself. I exclaimed, "The man's a ****! And the most stupid President in American History and with Ford and Reagan, that's saying something".

Don't wish to be unkind to the Cousins but it's my unvarnished opinion and was expressed before the Wall Street meltdown that's affected everyone except the Russians and Chinese (who could now buy the US Banking system).

A Trenchant opinion I admit, but the mind goes back to Clinton ("It's the Economy stupid") and how he left a Treasury surplus and filled all the underground reservoirs with cheap oil which Dubya has squandered. Apparently, if Clinton's econ pol had been maintained, the US would now have a US$Trillion surplus (feel free to contradict me, I may learn something) instead of....a US$Trillion debt. I also liked the US Congressman/Senator who grilled the ex-Lehman Boss, "You get to keep US$480M. Is that fair?". Pity he didn't ask the Fed Secretary about his request for US$700Bn. "You get to keep US$700M from your past Wall St activities. Is that fair?"

**PointyShinyBurn** · Posted On: 10/14/2008 6:47am

Originally Posted by f4n4n

remember that for instance "terrorists" from Chechnya bombed two housing blocks

There's pretty much no reason to doubt that the apartment block bombings were a false-flag operation by the FSB. The level of Putin's pre-knowledge or involvement can only be speculated upon.

**Eddie Hardon** · Posted On: 10/14/2008 7:55am

Originally Posted by PointyShinyBurn

There's pretty much no reason to doubt that the apartment block bombings were a false-flag operation by the FSB. The level of Putin's pre-knowledge or involvement can only be speculated upon.

On that note, you might want to read a memoir by Akaday somebodyorother in your local Waterstone's. It's lauded as modern day Russki "All Quiet etc". I wouldn't go that far but it helps to explain the 1945 Rape of Berllin....

I lent it to my Royal Marine Lieutenant Colonel colleague and he wanted to slash his wrists.

Grim stuff.:icon_pale

**Shawarma** · Posted On: 10/14/2008 12:59pm

Originally Posted by CrackFox

F4n4n, I'm not sure you understand the meaning of playing Devil's advocate. You could make some kind of "ends justify the means" type argument - that would be playing devil's advocate - bringing G.W. into the argument is just going off on a tangent. I'm no fan of Bush, but he's not relevant to this discussion (at least not in any of the ways you've listed).

I'm well aware that the Chechen's hands are far from clean, but look at what Putin has done there. In 1999 he went on record saying "If we catch them in the **** house, we'll whack them in the **** house," and then went on to carpet-bomb Grozny till there was practically nothing left.

Torture, murder? Why bother with extraordinary rendition when you can do it in the convenience of your own home. How about what was going on under Ramzan Kadyrov, the Kremlin-backed Prime Minister of Chechnya? Anna Politkovskaya calls for him to stand trial, and mysteriously gets shot. Infact, several high-profile people have been shot, poisioned or otherwise killed, with no effort made to hide it.

I'll point fingers where they need pointing, thank you very much.

I suggest you provide any kind of evidence that Putin personally had anything to do with the reporters death, you gigantic homosexual.

Funny, Putin has been very lamely linked to both the reporter and the spy-in-exile's death with nothing but ****** hysteria and russophobia to back it up and yet he's barely ever blamed for the mass murder of at least 100.000 Chechens, most of them civilians. He actually DID kill them.

**HappyOldGuy** · Posted On: 10/14/2008 1:12pm

Originally Posted by Shawarma

I suggest you provide any kind of evidence that Putin personally had anything to do with the reporters death, you gigantic homosexual.

Funny, Putin has been very lamely linked to both the reporter and the spy-in-exile's death with nothing but ****** hysteria and russophobia to back it up and yet he's barely ever blamed for the mass murder of at least 100.000 Chechens, most of them civilians. He actually DID kill them.

Well, ****** hysteria and a consistent pattern of dead bodies belonging to reporters and dissidents. In the one case killed using a mechanism only accessible to a handful of folks in the world and conclusively traced back to russia. But hey, if you wanted a blowjob, all you had to do was ask.

If you are trying to point out the double standard for dead chechens in the western media, that's an excellent point, but hardly one that exonerates Putin.