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  1. Greese is offline
    Greese's Avatar

    Motorboatin SOB

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    Springfield, MO
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    5,973

    Posted On:
    10/22/2002 8:10pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo and BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Well, actually it was Judo, but the same applies.
    Judo and JJ will be a lot more physical than a forms competition or TKD sparing.
    And that's when I figured out that tears couldn't make somebody who was dead alive again. There's another thing to learn about tears, they can't make somebody who doesn't love you any more love you again. It's the same with prayers. I wonder how much of their lives people waste crying and praying to God. If you ask me, the devil makes more sense than God does. I can at least see why people would want him around. It's good to have somebody to blame for the bad stuff they do. Maybe God's there because people get scared of all the bad stuff they do. They figure that God and the Devil are always playing this game of tug-of-war game with them. And they never know which side they're gonna wind up on. I guess that tug-of-war idea explains how sometimes, even when people try to do something good, it still turns out bad.
  2. Nihilanthic is offline

    Decafinated white belt.

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    JacksonFAILLE Flor-i-duh
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    Posted On:
    10/22/2002 9:20pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    They need to learn REAL self-defence (which is FIGHTING for those Politically Correct people), stay in shape, get CONFIDENCE, but be a good parent and make sure its NOT ARROGANCE.

    I sure wish my parents knew a thing or two about this, instead of being paranoid about me learning "things". I can just get a damn kitchen knife or make a bomb as-is. My step-dad is an ex green beret, so he was all for this. He also knew from the get go that TKD was "korean silly slap dancing" as he put it... my highschool offered it and I went. Total WTF, sport-oriented slap-pad target area garbage. At least we learned how to hit a bag properly, and to clinch a fist and keep your wrist straight. For better or worse, the class was discontinued, because only me and a few other kids wore out uniforms and actually PARTICIPATED.


    I also wish I started sooner... if I have kids I'm going to start when they can walk. I just hope my Signifigant Other can realize its not all about violence, or mystical/philosophical stuff (not that the latter is a bad thing). I don't want someone I brought into this world to have to suffer from bullying like I have.

    By the way - 8 year old blackbelts should be a capital crime... as in giving an 8 year old something that makes them think they're bruce lee and end up gettin hurt. Its dangerous, and insulting. Belts are meaningless to begin with, but they now have a negative meaning. Keeping people ignorant of things, fighting being one of them, is only a bad thing. You don't make them want to do things by educating them about it, you help them out. I'd rather have a child that can choose for themself instead of just doing what they're told and not being capable of decision making... I'm on a bit of a rant here because of the backlash against an attempt to give my Area's Sex Education for Highschoolers something other than "Abstinence untill marriage", with things like STD information, Contraception, SAFETY, being able to say NO, not taking abuse, tolerating deviant sexuality - with crap that even discussing the idea makes them want to do it. This attitude is present about Martial Arts and "fighting" in general, and is probably why garbage "self defence" classes exist.

    Just my .02.

    <Me> John, what do you know about Zen Buddhism? <John> *smacks me*
    <John> I'd have to smack you sometime...
    Katana, on 540 kicks: "Hang from a ceiling fan with both hands. Flail your feet out and ask people to walk into you as you hit their face."
  3. Fastlearner is offline

    Registered Member

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    Posted On:
    10/22/2002 9:48pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thanks everyone for the responses. I have three kids under the age of 11. The TKD will work for right now. The instructor is good and they're being challenged. Even if they were in a combat fighting class, they would not be able to defend themselves from an adult. That's my job.

    Fastlearner
  4. Clang is offline
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    Featherweight

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    Posted On:
    10/22/2002 9:57pm

    supporting member
     Style: "Doorgunner fu"

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Fastlearner,

    Where is the Judo club you were talking about?
    Clang
  5. Varkin

    Guest

    Posted On:
    10/22/2002 10:18pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    TKD is great for kids. I've always thought of TKD as a great starting point. You'll learn some good kicking basics, plus a few good looking trick kicks!

    I totall agree Nihilanthic, arrogance will get you beaten up! I always laugh when you see this guy whos all high on himself for knowing TKD or something, trying to take on somebody 3x their size. SMASH BLAM BOOM *splat*

    I think confidence is also knowing that there are lots of fights that you have no hope in hell of winning. For example, my best friend bounces at a strip club, and hes had no formal training whatsoever. I wouldn't last 10 seconds!
  6. Nihilanthic is offline

    Decafinated white belt.

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    JacksonFAILLE Flor-i-duh
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    Posted On:
    10/22/2002 10:18pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    No, of course not...

    Against other kids, yes. Having the instinct to poke their eyes and run instead of just screaming and panicing would be a help, and strategies for letting someone know that they're in trouble would get adult help, if they had to deal with someone who preys on children. The "real self-defence" angle was more geared towards mature teens. If they're under 11 they need to learn to scream and run, maybe bite.

    You found a good TKD school - and done better than the majority of BlackBelt Factory fodder. It doesn't seem like there is interest in becoming a full fledged hardcore conditioning 6 days a week MMA fighter, but at least you have the perspective that some MA is just garbage, and a lot of losers are just out there for the money. Just make sure your kids keep their feet on the ground - Everyone goes through a stage when they KNOW they are Bruce Lee and the world's strongest. Hopefully parents like yourself with an active interest in what their kids do at the Dojo/Dojang and a desire to know the real deal is aren't going to stay rare.

    Seems the site just justified its existance.


    <Me> John, what do you know about Zen Buddhism? <John> *smacks me*
    <John> I'd have to smack you sometime...
    Katana, on 540 kicks: "Hang from a ceiling fan with both hands. Flail your feet out and ask people to walk into you as you hit their face."
  7. Nihilanthic is offline

    Decafinated white belt.

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    JacksonFAILLE Flor-i-duh
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    Posted On:
    10/22/2002 10:19pm


     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    No, of course not was oriented to the fact that its the parents job to defend kids under 11 aginst adults... seems I took a while writing this last post

    Oh, and varkin - you can't just use kicks and expect to get anywhere but the ground... face first. Your arms need to do something too. The danger of focusing on just kicks and trick kicks with kids is that they start to think they're invulnerable, that its all they need, and that those tricks will impress people to the point that they need never fight. Parents need to step in and put them back on the ground. Kicks sure look impressive, and they have their time and place, but not all the time, and everywhere. If all they do is point-spar and do pretty kicks, they need to know thats all they can do with it. It takes fighting (sparring) experience to be able to fight.

    <Me> John, what do you know about Zen Buddhism? <John> *smacks me*
    <John> I'd have to smack you sometime...

    Edited by - Nihilanthic on October 22 2002 22:26:54
    Katana, on 540 kicks: "Hang from a ceiling fan with both hands. Flail your feet out and ask people to walk into you as you hit their face."
  8. Varkin

    Guest

    Posted On:
    10/22/2002 10:35pm


     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Thats why I said its a good place to start, get the basics down. Minus, of course, the punches... TKD's from the hip punches annoy me!

    Ahh well, I got my start with TKD and it helped me alot. But really, if somebody attacks you, scoring points isnt going to be much of a defence! :D
  9. Deadpan Scientist is offline

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    Posted On:
    10/22/2002 11:15pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I said sport judo, not jj, but here are the facts, straight from a peer reviewed journal
    ---------------------------------------
    Percept Mot Skills 2002 Feb;94(1):21-5 Related Articles, Links

    Effect of traditional judo training on aggressiveness among young boys.

    Reynes E, Lorant J.

    Laboratoire Sport et Regulations Sociales Universite de Nice Sophia-Antipolis, France.

    This study assessed the effect of one year of traditional judo training on aggressiveness among young boys. 27 primary school pupils and 28 judo students were asked to complete the Buss-Perry Aggression Questionnaire at two times 1 year apart. Analysis showed that judoka were more aggressive (had higher scores on Total Aggression, Verbal Aggression, and Anger) than the control group after one year of training, even if variations in aggressiveness were not significant. So, results do not support the view that judo training leads to less aggressiveness in a sample of children this young.

    PMID: 11883564 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
    ---------------------------------------------------

    Here is another study on TMA's effect on school children. The main difference seems to be in the aspect of competition.
    ------------------------------------------------
    Adolescence 2001 Fall;36(143):443-59 Related Articles, Links

    An effective approach to violence prevention: traditional martial arts in middle school.

    Zivin G, Hassan NR, DePaula GF, Monti DA, Harlan C, Hossain KD, Patterson K.

    Department of Psychiatry and Human Behavior, Jefferson Medical College, Thomas Jefferson University, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania 19107, USA.

    This study replicated and extended the design and outcome measures of several small studies. In these studies, juveniles at high risk for violence and delinquency showed decreased violence and positive changes in psychological risk factors after being required to take a school-linked course in traditional martial arts. In the present study, 60 boys in a large urban middle school were required to take a traditional martial arts course in their school. They were paired on problematic behavior profiles and assigned to a treatment group or to a wait-list control group. Thirty classes, three per week (45 minutes each), were taught by a master of Koga Ha Kosho Shorei Ryu Kempo and his assistant (neither was a public school teacher). Results are reported here for 14 variables from the following measures: four teacher rating scales from the Sutter-Eyberg Student Behavior Inventory, five self-report scales of the Piers-Harris Self-Concept Scale, four computerized measures of attentional self-control from the Intermediate Visual and Auditory Continuous Performance Test, and a count of permanent expulsions from school. The treatment students improved over baseline on 12 variables, while the controls improved on 5 by small amounts and deteriorated from baseline on 8, including teacher-rated violence. There were significant differences between the groups on self-reported happiness and schoolwork and on one measure of attention. After controls took the course, their scores resembled the postcourse scores of the treatment group. Importantly, the control group's increase in teacher-rated violence was reversed. Both groups were then pooled to compare baseline and postcourse teacher ratings. Their scores improved significantly in the areas of resistance to rules, impulsiveness, and inappropriate social behavior. There was also improvement in regard to violence, but the change in scores was not statistically significant. Follow-up on teachers' ratings showed that improvement remained, and in some cases increased, four months after completion of the course. Interestingly, all 6 permanent expulsions were among the control group students who had not yet taken, or had only begun taking, the martial arts course.

    PMID: 11817627 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
  10. Clang is offline
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    Featherweight

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    90

    Posted On:
    10/22/2002 11:23pm

    supporting member
     Style: "Doorgunner fu"

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    brandeissansoo

    Thanks for the info, it was VERY interesting. Dont know why my brain translated judo to JJ. Sorry,

    Thanks again
    Clang
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