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  1. FickleFingerOfFate is offline
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    Guess which finger is the fickle one...

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    Posted On:
    8/16/2008 3:56pm

    supporting member
     Style: Karate/ Arnis

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    My take was that he didn't like the idea of every back alley Karate gym waving the ATT banner.

    I can see how one of their primary trainers might be a little pissed about something he helped build changing business models, especially 'franchising' the MMA certification,
    If you can't laugh at yourself,
    Others will be happy to do it for you. :evil6:

    The 2 most abundant elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity.


  2. Snake Plissken is offline
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    When I Get Back

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    Posted On:
    8/16/2008 4:02pm

    supporting member
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by sochin101
    I can't imagine that methods appropriate for full-time professional MMA fighters would mesh with workaday stripmall generic krotty, but I do see your point.
    Well I figure he probably had to devise some models to give his guys the edge.

    I still think that (while I'm sure André Benkei's intentions are honourable and his integrity has made him take this course of action) it's a decent bit of publicity for someone who is probably looking for fighters to work with...

    But, then, I'm a cynical bastard at best.
    So you think this is a coup?
    He's going to try and pot-lick the ATT fighters?
  3. sochin101 is offline
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    Graviora Manent

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    Posted On:
    8/16/2008 4:28pm

    Join us... or die
     Style: No gym currently.

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by FickleFingerOfFate
    My take was that he didn't like the idea of every back alley Karate gym waving the ATT banner.

    I can see how one of their primary trainers might be a little pissed about something he helped build changing business models, especially 'franchising' the MMA certification,
    it's taken him some time to be pissed enough to leave. Publicly.

    Quote Originally Posted by Snake
    Well I figure he probably had to devise some models to give his guys the edge.
    fo' Sho', but, like I said, I can't think that his specialty would be particularly useful to the end user, ie the once a week krotty guy signing up at an ATT certified school. You wouldn't necessarily need a specialist to design a fitness programme for your average dude.
    Quote Originally Posted by Snake
    So you think this is a coup?
    He's going to try and pot-lick the ATT fighters?
    I don't think that the ATT guys would leave the team unless they were also pissed at the possible dilution (or perception of).
    Of course, if there are any others thinking the same way, well, like I said, that's a decent advertisement he's got out there.
    Where there is only a choice between cowardice and violence, I would advise violence.

    Gandhi

  4. 7thSamurai is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/16/2008 6:19pm


     Style: BJJ, Striking, TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    There's a place here in town that I've just learned is using the ATT name to attract more students. I don't know much about it so far since I've just heard about it. There was a lady friend I was speaking with who was saying that such-n-such person trained at ATT and was an ATT fighter. I've been curious about it since that point.

    I googled it and came back with a few hits. One was on Craigslist and another was a website that listed info nearly identical to the CL post.



    12/31: American Top Team Training in Austin

    Train Like An MMA Champion!!!

    Learn Mixed Martial Arts (MMA) from the experts. Our MMA instructors have been certified by American Top Team (ATT), one of the largest and most successful Mixed Martial Arts teams in the world.

    Our ATT MMA Program is one of the most comprehensive training sessions in MMA and Brazilian Jui-Jutsu (BJJ) today. By enrolling in this program we will "accelerate your clock" in terms of progress and improvement.

    MMA Training includes both technical and tactical elements essential to the game. The individual skills vital to success in MMA are stressed in a competitive environment. The MMA program is designed to help individuals perform and execute high level techniques while demonstrating a keen insight into the game's nuances.

    Fitness Training in all aspects including speed, agility, quickness, strength, power, endurance are addressed in our Program.

    In just 4 short years, ATT's World Wide success stories and honor roll are impressive. It is not by chance that ATT is the largest and most active fight team in the world today. Under the tutelage of Master Ricardo Liborio of Brazilian Top Team fame, ATT will continue to create winners day after day in life and beyond.... Come join the team today and see what it is all about!


    I don't know much about the school and it's out of my way, but I'm interested in learning what I can about it. I don't think it was a good idea to market the ATT name in such a manner. It bastardizes the name. If crappy schools are training with ATT and then passing their crappy training with an ATT stamp on the others, it's going to cause problems.
  5. Naszir is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/16/2008 8:31pm


     Style: BJJ, Judo, SAMBO

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Selfcritical can tell you more about that school as he attends it and Variance fought in an FMA tournament there earlier this year. TBH, that particular school does offer quality instruction in the Inosanto Academy taught arts, I-L kali, Filipino boxing, SHOOTO, etc. I can't help but think the ATT name will help bring in more of the MMA seeking crowd which is fairly sizable seeing as there are quite a few bjj/mma gyms in the area now.
  6. 7thSamurai is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/16/2008 8:41pm


     Style: BJJ, Striking, TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Fair enough, Nazir, but I have to ask if it's proper to state;

    "Under the tutelage of Master Ricardo Liborio of Brazilian Top Team fame, ATT will continue to create winners day after day in life and beyond.... Come join the team today and see what it is all about!"

    As I read it, it sounds as if the new recruit is a part of ATT and that Liborio is somehow involved in training through the affiliation. I don't knock the school. I know a couple of people who have trained there, I just don't agree with the ATT claims.
  7. selfcritical is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/17/2008 12:57am


     Style: Pekiti, ARMA, other stuff

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I haven't been to the "ATT" class, which is distinct from the normal shooto/vale tudo class. My understanding is that it's pretty much verbatim the curriculum in the seminars, while he teaches whatever he thinks appropriate in his own vale tudo class.

    I haven't been to the class to evaluate it, butg the idea of such a short curriclum (most of which is covered in the shooto/vale tudo class anyway) for additional charge does bother me a bit. Larrys gone back out to ATT a few times and worked out/trained with Din thomas a few times since then, but I don't believe those training sessions had anything to do with the curriculum as presented in the class(because the things he worked on during those trips would be such fine-tuning adjustments that it wouldn't even come up for most of his students).

    So while I believe Larry a competent instructor, and understand wanting some kind of brand recognition associated with his MMA program, I personally disagree with his marketing choice.
  8. 7thSamurai is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/17/2008 1:24am


     Style: BJJ, Striking, TKD

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by selfcritical
    I haven't been to the "ATT" class, which is distinct from the normal shooto/vale tudo class. My understanding is that it's pretty much verbatim the curriculum in the seminars, while he teaches whatever he thinks appropriate in his own vale tudo class.

    I haven't been to the class to evaluate it, butg the idea of such a short curriclum (most of which is covered in the shooto/vale tudo class anyway) for additional charge does bother me a bit. Larrys gone back out to ATT a few times and worked out/trained with Din thomas a few times since then, but I don't believe those training sessions had anything to do with the curriculum as presented in the class(because the things he worked on during those trips would be such fine-tuning adjustments that it wouldn't even come up for most of his students).

    So while I believe Larry a competent instructor, and understand wanting some kind of brand recognition associated with his MMA program, I personally disagree with his marketing choice.
    I appreciate the response on that. I've got no personal bone to pick regarding it since I've got nothing vested in it either way. I was just kind of struck that the person I was talking to, who lacked much knowledge regarding MMA (or any martial arts) in general, was able to point out they were running an ATT program there.
  9. Naszir is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/17/2008 1:31am


     Style: BJJ, Judo, SAMBO

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I was only referring to what I personally know about the school which was why I mentioned Selfcritical as he has first hand knowledge of it. Good point about the name dropping though.
  10. KayRoc is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/17/2008 1:38am


     Style: Crappling (BJJ Hiatus)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    This saddens me. As much as I like to see more people training in MMA and BJJ, this is going down the 'watered down' route. I have came across too many guys that claim to train 'BJJ'(the crappling kind that isnt legit), or MMA, only to discover they have a **** game, and they train at shitty places that shouldnt be associated with MMA, or claiming BJJ.

    Boo ATT. Fix this problem.
    Last edited by KayRoc; 8/17/2008 8:59pm at .
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