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  1. Sang is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2008 9:21am


     Style: MMA, Yoga

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    More like Judo wins.

    - A lot of fights start close range with them up in your chest, perfect throwing range.

    - Most people wear clothing, handy for chokes and holds for throws.

    - hard surfaces suck to be thrown on.

    -Much less liability problems, you can say you were restraining him as aposed to the muay thai 'i elbowed and kneed him in the face because i was pretty sure he was about to throw a punch, i collected most of his teeth.. here they are'

    But i don't train for self defense, **** that. Oh, and bonus points for talking about street fights in noobie discussion.. oh yeah.
  2. Sang is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2008 9:24am


     Style: MMA, Yoga

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark
    First of all I think this is total bullshit if you train how to punch bare knuckled:
    "there is a decent sized chance you are going to break your hand if you throw barenuckle punches to the head*"

    Also there seems to be this false idea that untrained palm heels are better than even trained punching which I think is patently ridiculous.

    Maybe this only applies to me but I train to punch people. I don't train to palm heel people. How could it be a better idea to plan to use something I don't train in a high pressure situation?
    How would you train to fight barenuckled WS, mainly hit bags with only wraps on or bare nuckled, spar people with that cage headgear on?

    Your other two points are good and i agree with them.
  3. WhiteShark is offline
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    1% Shark is better than you.

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2008 9:31am

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: BJJ/Shidokan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    In Shidokan we trained for bare knuckle tournaments. Hitting the makiwara and a leather heavy bag bare knuckle was the general way. Also sparring with no gear teaches you to pick your shots pretty fast. Knuckle push ups and all the stuff that trains you to have strong wrists and hit with the strong part of your hand. I also did tons of hand excercises with putty and spring loaded hand flexers.
  4. Sang is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2008 9:38am


     Style: MMA, Yoga

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Nice, if we hit the heavy bag sans-wraps at my gym we get told off very quickly. A few guys who rocked up without gloves were told to go grab some from the 10 year old gloves bin or go home since it causes so many injuries. They were relatively new to training so fair enough.

    Do you do finger pushups? I've added them to my training regime after reading one of Ross' books, might add in some nuckle ones too for wrist strength.
  5. 3moose1 is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2008 9:55am

    Join us... or die
     Style: MCMAP, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark
    In the bare knuckle karate tournaments
    t3h kum1t3? :p


    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark
    Also there seems to be this false idea that untrained palm heels are better than even trained punching which I think is patently ridiculous.

    Maybe this only applies to me but I train to punch people. I don't train to palm heel people. How could it be a better idea to plan to use something I don't train in a high pressure situation?
    I don't think the basis of this thread was, "Attn: People who know what they are doing, do NOT do that, imitate bruce lee, and palm heel the **** out of homies"

    I think it was, "Should people, in a self defense situation, learn to punch, or learn to palm-heel?"

    Which, to answer the question i just sort of asked, i think it would be easier and faster to teach someone how to correctly palm-heel an attacker in the face, then to punch them, with less chance of injury.

    (this is for normal joe and schmo, not people like WhiteShark who have faught and won in the kumite.)

    PROOF that I'm not a completely useless poster:
    http://www.bullshido.net/forums/show...0&postcount=58


    Quote Originally Posted by Cy Q. Faunce
    3moose1 is correct. Sig THAT, you fucker.

    Quote Originally Posted by sochin101 View Post
    I went out with a delightful young woman who was on a regimen of pills that made her taste of burned onions.
    That is not conducive to passionate cunnilingus, my friend, let me assure you.
    Quote Originally Posted by HappyOldGuy View Post
    I agree with moosey
  6. WhiteShark is offline
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    1% Shark is better than you.

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2008 10:22am

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     Style: BJJ/Shidokan

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Sang
    Do you do finger pushups? I've added them to my training regime after reading one of Ross' books, might add in some nuckle ones too for wrist strength.
    I do mainly BJJ now so I'm not doing as many funny karate exercises but I used to do finger and knuckle pushups and some other weird ones. Karate is kinda like that though. The worst was thumb pushups. I can't do even one now. You can learn them by starting with a tripod between our thumb, first and second knuckle. Then take away the second knuckle then the first until you are doing pushups on your thumbs.

    What is the use of this excercise? I really don't know but it's hard as hell and all the best bareknuckle guys I knew could do it.

    Here is a video of these silly pushups:
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Na0OLjvkSJg
    Last edited by WhiteShark; 8/13/2008 10:28am at .
  7. TheMightyMcClaw is offline
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    MADE OF STEEL!

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    Posted On:
    8/13/2008 10:29am

    supporting member
     Style: MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark
    First of all I think this is total bullshit if you train how to punch bare knuckled:
    "there is a decent sized chance you are going to break your hand if you throw barenuckle punches to the head*"

    Also there seems to be this false idea that untrained palm heels are better than even trained punching which I think is patently ridiculous.

    Maybe this only applies to me but I train to punch people. I don't train to palm heel people. How could it be a better idea to plan to use something I don't train in a high pressure situation?
    I concur with this sentiment. One of the reasons I became so sketpical around the palm heel was that I saw it being advocated for self-defense in striking arts that don't actually use it in their sparring (karate, TKD, etc.). It made me wonder why you would want punch someone when training, but then suddenly switch to a different weapon you've never actually landed before in a "real fight."
  8. 1point2 is online now
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2008 10:50am

    Join us... or die
     Style: 剛 and 柔

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by TheMightyMcClaw
    I concur with this sentiment. One of the reasons I became so sketpical around the palm heel was that I saw it being advocated for self-defense in striking arts that don't actually use it in their sparring (karate, TKD, etc.). It made me wonder why you would want punch someone when training, but then suddenly switch to a different weapon you've never actually landed before in a "real fight."
    This is a good point. Does anyone (except Pancrasists, I guess?) spar with palm strikes, NOT SLAPS, to the head and body?

    EDIT: I also fully concur with moose:
    I think it was, "Should people, in a self defense situation, learn to punch, or learn to palm-heel?"

    Which, to answer the question i just sort of asked, i think it would be easier and faster to teach someone how to correctly palm-heel an attacker in the face, then to punch them, with less chance of injury.
  9. DdlR is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2008 4:26pm

    supporting member
     Style: Bartitsu

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by WhiteShark
    First of all I think this is total bullshit if you train how to punch bare knuckled:
    "there is a decent sized chance you are going to break your hand if you throw barenuckle punches to the head*"

    Also there seems to be this false idea that untrained palm heels are better than even trained punching which I think is patently ridiculous.

    Maybe this only applies to me but I train to punch people. I don't train to palm heel people. How could it be a better idea to plan to use something I don't train in a high pressure situation?
    For context, the OP was a spin-off from a women's self defense thread, positing only a short term training course for people who were not athletes and had no plans to make a long term training/conditioning commitment.
  10. OZZ is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/13/2008 5:02pm

    supporting member
     Style: Short Fist Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Regarding the different types of push-ups, I think just doing a few sets a week of 20-30 regular knuckle push ups ( 10 or 15 with weight on front tow, 10 or 15 with weight on the back two) is sufficient for strengthening your hands and wrists. Tiger claw push ups etc. are hard and although they make your hands quite strong, they are harder on the joints then regular ones and without proper medicine you risk ruining your hands down the road.
    I don't do anything but knuckle push ups because that is just what I am used to now.
    Also, shift to your side and support your weight on one fist for 30 seconds to a minute after finishing your set as well.
    Just my two cents..well, in my case ten cents because I am so fucking good.:profe:
    " If one wants to have a friend one must also want to wage war for him: and to wage war one must be capable of being an enemy." - Fr. Nietzsche 'On The Friend' Thus Spake Zarathustra
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