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  1. rw4th is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/02/2008 11:10pm


     Style: BJJ,MT,RBSD (on hiatus)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    It's a Bujinkan spin off, so if what you want to do is LARP the traditional Japanese arts, then go for it.
    Last edited by rw4th; 8/02/2008 11:13pm at .
    <insert witty comment>
  2. Fitz is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/18/2008 10:25am


     Style: Judo, Tomiki Aikido, ??

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    The following is a good article-length piece on Fumio Manaka's background

    http://www.jinenkanseigi.com/clouds&water.htm

    It includes some information on his experience with Judo, his time with the Japanese Defense Force, his training with Hatsumi Sensei and how he came to his current teaching and organization.
  3. Troy Wideman is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/21/2008 7:00am


     Style: Genbukan Ninpo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by gladius
    It is the modest, unknown, quiet version of the bujinkan.

    Manaka is another gentle Japanese shihan that cannot fight and had never fought in any documented fight. Jinenkan is the poor man's Bujinkan in a way.
    Perfect for people that want to live the ninja-ancient arts thing, but also want feel different at the same time.
    Fraud scale goes this way, from worst to "best": Ashida Kim, Bujinkan, Genbukan, Jinenkan.

    Hello Gladius,

    I am curious, what is your basis for saying fraud. Usually if your going to make a fraud case you have undisputed fact. Now if you do not have undisbuted fact you a getting close to something called defamation of character. What is your fact!

    Kind Regards,

    Troy Wideman
    Genbukan Mugen Dojo
  4. Fitz is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/21/2008 9:38am


     Style: Judo, Tomiki Aikido, ??

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Chances are Gladius isn't aware that calling someone a fraud, even on the internet, has legal implications.
  5. shinbushi is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/21/2008 4:21pm


     Style: Muay Thai, Judo, BJJ

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Gladius you need to see the thread discussing how a certain ninja too E-budo to court and all the money it cost them.
    I am too lazy to look for it
  6. Troy Wideman is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/21/2008 9:26pm


     Style: Genbukan Ninpo

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by gladius
    "OOuuuuuuHHHHHH! I am so afraid.....There are legal implications"...
    Hahaha, get serious, you politically-correct-living-by-the-book woose.
    Imaging going to court and saying "Gladius called my client a fraud in Bullshido.com" hahahaha!
    Hi Gladius,

    I did not ask if you were afraid, I ask for your fact!
    I noticed you state you study BJJ, who is your teacher?

    Kind Regards,

    Troy Wideman
    Genbukan Mugen Dojp
  7. rw4th is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/21/2008 9:48pm


     Style: BJJ,MT,RBSD (on hiatus)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Troy Wideman
    Hello Gladius,

    I am curious, what is your basis for saying fraud. Usually if your going to make a fraud case you have undisputed fact. Now if you do not have undisbuted fact you a getting close to something called defamation of character. What is your fact!

    Kind Regards,

    Troy Wideman
    Genbukan Mugen Dojo
    While they all have some legit licenses in Judo and a few koryu arts, all claims to ninjutsu lineage before Takamatsu are fraudulent. In fact, just about everything ninjutsu that the westerners just love to eat up is fraudulent: the history, the "generations", the fantastical tales of former masters, everything.
    <insert witty comment>
  8. Fitz is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/21/2008 10:08pm


     Style: Judo, Tomiki Aikido, ??

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Rw4th:

    There is a difference between unverified and fraudulent.

    Gladius:

    Here's the basics on this.

    I can call you or anyone else a delusional wackbag., an asshole, jackass, shithead, douchebag, etc. til the cows come home in a public forum. But calling you are a fraud would crossed a line that is actionable unless I can prove in the legal sense that you are indeed a fraud.

    If you don't like Ninjutsu in general or specificallythe Takamatsuden, that's fine, feel free to say so. If you wanted to say "The [Bullshit, Crap, Suck] scale goes this way, from worst to "best": Ashida Kim, Bujinkan, Genbukan, Jinenkan." that's not a problem. Claims of fraud require a different set of criteria. Looking into the various investigations that Bullshido has conducted to get a sense of what that criteria would be.
  9. OniSan81 is offline

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    Posted On:
    8/21/2008 10:39pm


     Style: Genbukan Ninpo Bugei

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I train with and know a lot of BJJ guys, from Paulo Cardoso, to guys at White Tiger Jiu Jitsu and Kombat Arts. Their opinions of Ninpo vary, but they all respect a strong practioner who tests him or herself.

    Manaka Sensei is great, comes across as wonderfully kind and incredibly agile for his age in particular!
    Last edited by OniSan81; 8/21/2008 10:48pm at .
  10. rw4th is offline
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    Posted On:
    8/21/2008 11:27pm


     Style: BJJ,MT,RBSD (on hiatus)

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by Fitz
    Rw4th:

    There is a difference between unverified and fraudulent.

    Gladius:

    Here's the basics on this.

    I can call you or anyone else a delusional wackbag., an asshole, jackass, shithead, douchebag, etc. til the cows come home in a public forum. But calling you are a fraud would crossed a line that is actionable unless I can prove in the legal sense that you are indeed a fraud.

    If you don't like Ninjutsu in general or specificallythe Takamatsuden, that's fine, feel free to say so. If you wanted to say "The [Bullshit, Crap, Suck] scale goes this way, from worst to "best": Ashida Kim, Bujinkan, Genbukan, Jinenkan." that's not a problem. Claims of fraud require a different set of criteria. Looking into the various investigations that Bullshido has conducted to get a sense of what that criteria would be.
    It goes beyond unverified. Hatsumi in particular has made claims of lineage where ninjutsu is concerned, profited greatly from his claims, and when challenged refused to step up with any proof (or did and was laughed at depending on which version of the story you believe). No authentic proof of any kind has ever been found outside of what Hatsumi supposedly posses.

    People tend to chalk this up to this being about how a fool and his money are easily parted, but it's still lying for profit which is the very definition of fraud.

    To their credit both the Genbukan and Jinenkan tend to shy away from anything "Ninja" but it's still there. They still talk about Togakure-Ryu, "Ninpo" and various other ninjutsu related garbage, and while I don't know enough about these two organizations to have any real opinion on them, in my opinion they still perpetuate Hatsumi's bullshit by maintaining any pretext that they are historically linked to ninjutsu.
    Last edited by rw4th; 8/21/2008 11:32pm at .
    <insert witty comment>
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