Jim Wagner's military, police, counter-terror creds in question.

***DerAuslander*** · Posted On: 7/15/2008 10:16am

Yeah, I am not impressed with the knife work at all. Most of the vids showed the knife held in the rear hand & far too much reaching with the front empty hand. That's just asking for an arterial bleed.

**A.M.** · Posted On: 7/15/2008 12:26pm

Here is yet another Jim Wagner knife fighting video

YouTube - Police and Military Knife Offense

Also a trailer for a video on the police baton that Jim Wagner did

YouTube - Police Baton

**Sam Browning** · Posted On: 7/16/2008 12:33pm

Hoch updated his question list for Wagner again. See the list below.

Question 1)
Do you have any Black Belts? (yes or no, and if so, in what?)

Question 2)
Did you really believe that you are the sole, beginner/founder/father of "reality-based training?"
Or, is it an advertising gambit?

Question 3)
Were you ever an active duty, full time, street cop?

Question 4) A SWAT 2-Parter
a) Did you actively raid and perform actual, high risk SWAT jobs? Or was this a reserve,
support position?
b) How many High Risk, Diplomatic Escorts did you REALLY do in Costa Mesa, CA?

Question 5)
How exactly were you discharged from the Army after 8 months?

Question 6)
Did you ever say or advertise, or suggest that you were in US Army Special Forces?

Question 7)
Did you feel funny at all advertising that you performed 140 (or 240?), "post 9-11" counter-terrorism missions? As a sky marshal flying in planes?

Question 8-
Do you know Chuck Habermelh, police and police trainer?

Question 9)
Your use of the title "Sergeant." This was just an ad-nickname right? Then you became a real SGT in the state military reserves as late as 2006? (This seems to be an issue in the POWNET. You could clear that up and say was it used as an advertisement gambit?)

Question 10) Three-part question
- Why do you never mention HSS International in your EXTENSIVE, "day-by-day" resume?
- Why did they fire you and why are you not suitable for re-hire?
- Many of the agencies you claim to teach, were actually first obtained by HSS and not by you?
Yes? No? HSS has tens and tens of instructors. You were one of the throng?

Question 11)
Why were you forced to leave the Orange County Sheriff's Office Reserves?

Question 12)
You say, you taught a "myriad of courses" at Camp Pendleton. Define a myriad? What were they exactly and to whom. (we know you helped as a police reserve in a helping group at sniper course once - what are these other "myraids" of courses? Why only display one, "help-out certificate" while you have these myriads of courses you yourself taught them alone.

Question 13)
Why exactly...were you forced to prematurely leave the Sky Marshals?

**Bishop** · Posted On: 7/16/2008 5:34pm

Looks like Hock has done some good background investigating. But since Hock was a real cop, I would expect nothing less.

**Sam Browning** · Posted On: 7/16/2008 9:29pm

I was reading archived versions of Jim Wagner’s website since April 2003 on a tool called "wayback machine"

There is some interesting stuff there. See http://web.archive.org/web/*/http://...ertraining.com

Few martial arts instructors in the world can come close to Jim Wagner’s background- former soldier, jailer, street cop, SWAT officer, diplomatic bodyguard, and just recently, a counter terrorist with the United States government. This impressive career includes 12 years of Police and Military Tactics and Defensive Tactics Instructor (having trained personnel from over 500 of the world’s top units) and 26 years in the martial arts: Israeli Special Forces KAPAP & HISARDUT, Krav Maga, Jeet Kune Do, Wing Chun, Brazilian Jujitsu, La Boxe Fran?aise, Western boxing, Thai kickboxing, Greco-Roman wrestling, Aikido, Judo, Karate Ryobu Kai, Kendo, Po Keck kung-fu, Kenpo, European fencing, Tae Kwon Do, Tai Chi Chuan, archery, U.S. Army and U.S. Marines Close Quarters Combat. Jim has also taught in Canada, Mexico, Brazil, Argentina, Finland, Spain, United Kingdom, Germany, and Israel. When you have Jim Wagner teach at your school, you’re getting someone with real-world operations experience. Jim has also taught hundreds of civilians in an easy and understandable way. (April 14, 2003)

http://web.archive.org/web/200304150...im_Wagner.html

Have you heard of the term “Reality-Based?” If you’re in the martial arts world then you most likely have. It was Jim Wagner who first coined the term, and now it is used globally to represent a whole new direction in the martial arts. Reality-Based is rooted in police, corrections, and military training concepts. Jim was the first to introduce this model as it applies in civilian defensive situations. Read more about the origins of 1. Reality-Based Martial Arts
Jim Wagner introduced the phrase and the concept of Reality-Based martial arts to the civilian martial arts world through his monthly columns in Black Belt magazine (North America) and Budo magazine (Europe, South America and the Middle East - printed in six languages). See some of the articles for yourself. Now, his ideas are rapidly becoming the future teaching mode that will forever change the martial arts - pre-conflict training, conflict training, post conflict training and instructor certification. (May 30, 2003)

http://web.archive.org/web/200305300...rtraining.com/

And, when it comes to actual conflict techniques, few martial arts instructors in the world can come close to Jim Wagner?s system and background: former soldier, jailer, street cop, SWAT officer, diplomatic bodyguard, and just recently a counterterrorist for the United States government on 146 missions. This impressive military, corrections and law enforcement career also includes 12 years as a certified Police & Military Defensive Tactics instructor, training personnel from literally hundreds of the world's top units, including: German GSG9, Brazilian GATE, Argentinean GOE, Israeli Special Forces, California Department of Corrections, Helsinki Police Department, FBI SWAT, US Coast Guard, US Marshals Service, US Marines PMO, US Navy PMO, US Army Military Police, US Air Force Security Forces, Brazilian GEPA, British Columbia Sheriff's Department, INS, US Border Patrol, California Highway Patrol, Spanish Foreign Legion (Grupo de Operaciones Especiales), North Miami Police Department, University of Washington Police, Los Angeles School Police SWAT, Los Angeles Probation, and the list goes on. (December 18, 2003)
1.
http://web.archive.org/web/200312180...rtraining.com/

In addition, Jim Wagner has been instructing civilian courses since 1981. (June 6, 2004)
1.
http://web.archive.org/web/200406061...rtraining.com/

December 30, 2004

A really interesting discussion of his personal martial arts history.

http://web.archive.org/web/200411080...im_Wagner.html

September 11, 2002 was my last day as a FAM. On September 12th the Special Agent in Charge of the Los Angeles Field Office gave me the standard government Exit Interview. The following day I was training other agencies in counterterrorist tactics.
1.
(July 8, 2006)

**Dsimon3387** · Posted On: 7/16/2008 9:48pm

Wait Sam I can explain.... You know those clips they used in clockwork orange? Well I got me some of those and I found all manner of martial insomiacs.... So I don't sleep see? I put my eye clips on and train the night away.

**Bishop** · Posted On: 7/16/2008 10:16pm

"Six months after the United States of America was attacked by the worst act of terrorism in history I was sworn in as a United States Federal Air Marshal." That would be Feb. 2002 .

"September 11, 2002 was my last day as a FAM. On September 12th the Special Agent in Charge of the Los Angeles Field Office gave me the standard government Exit Interview. The following day I was training other agencies in counterterrorist tactics.
1."
(July 8, 2006)

8 months later he's either quit or failed probation and been fired. The first 2-3 months would have been academy training. So that leaves 6 months riding in airplanes hoping no terrorists make it past airport security and onto your plane. Obviously none did, so he prevented terrorist attacks in "146 missions" (flights).