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  1. WhiteShark is offline
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    1% Shark is better than you.

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    Posted On:
    12/01/2011 11:09am

    supporting memberforum leaderstaff
     Style: BJJ/Shidokan

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Double collar tie is not the only clinch there is in MT. In fact we recently discussed that it isn't particularly common unless your opponent sucks at defending it. No one trains to only use a double collar tie. In Plumm practice you switch grips constantly. Obviously it would be stupid to say that MT is the better throwing art but the clinch focus is not as narrow as a lot of people think.
  2. robdaze151 is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/01/2011 12:11pm


     Style: American Kickboxing

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    I believe the set up for the throws and the ability to transition from striking to clinch grappling is exactly what widens the gap. Not shitting on MT. as I stated I love the art but in relation to MMA sanshou offers and counters a lot more factors.
  3. Ming Loyalist is offline
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    solves problems with violence

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    Posted On:
    12/01/2011 12:22pm

    supporting member
     Style: Judo, Hung Family Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    As MMA grows in popularity in china, and more Sanda fighters transition to it, we will see how it works out. Until then it's all speculation.
    "Face punches are an essential character building part of a martial art. You don't truly love your children unless you allow them to get punched in the face." - chi-conspiricy
    "When I was a little boy, I had a sailor suit, but it didn't mean I was in the Navy." - Mtripp on the subject of a 5 year old karate black belt
    "Without actual qualifications to be a Zen teacher, your instructor is just another roundeye raping Asian culture for a buck." - Errant108
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  4. robdaze151 is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/01/2011 12:33pm


     Style: American Kickboxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    so we have to wait for chinese to start transitioning before we can argue it? I mean Cung le made a fantastic transition albeit a little late but was pretty successful. not being a cung groupiejust stating that as he may not be the only one he is the most popular. Truth be told if we wait for the Chinese it will only further prove the pro sanshou/sanda argument. Right now there is some little kid being forcefed HGH and chinese wheatties right before practice.
  5. Mark-E-Mark is offline

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    Posted On:
    12/22/2011 4:01pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!


    After watching this video I think San shou seems to be better suited to MMA competitive fighting. (I didn't know what it was so I looked it up)

    In saying that though, as someone who trains in MT, I think the knees and elbows are good tools and one should train to use them also.
  6. MMAMickey is offline
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    Posted On:
    12/23/2011 5:57am

    Join us... or die
     Style: Boxing.MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Quote Originally Posted by robdaze151 View Post
    so we have to wait for chinese to start transitioning before we can argue it? I mean Cung le made a fantastic transition albeit a little late but was pretty successful. not being a cung groupiejust stating that as he may not be the only one he is the most popular. Truth be told if we wait for the Chinese it will only further prove the pro sanshou/sanda argument. Right now there is some little kid being forcefed HGH and chinese wheatties right before practice.
    Lyoto Machida also transitioned from karate. You can't say the system works in MMA until more than the odd one or two can get away with using it.

    That being said, in my experience sanshou is very useful for MMA; it's the training methods which often let it down.
    "The hero and the coward both feel the same thing, but the hero projects his fear onto his opponent while the coward runs. 'Fear'. It's the same thing, but it's what you do with it that matters". - Cus D'Amato
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  7. quddha is offline

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    Posted On:
    1/07/2012 4:06pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Cung Le is the most popular Sanshou fighter in MMA, but there are many more, and not from China either, although many of them are still in the smaller organizations.

    Check out Bazigit Atajev (trained in same Russian sanda school as my coach), Pierre Moua (France), Team Lakay (Philippines). Alex Cisne (USA) competes in Sanshou.

    These guys have all competed in the World Wushu Championships (which Cung Le won Bronze twice). I made a compilation video from some of the footage I took of the most recent one, in which some of these guys participated:



    I think this kind of style is very applicable to MMA. Why you don't see it as often has less to do with the style, but more to do with the popularity of the art.

    In general, Muay Thai culture is better established. It's been around longer, there is a larger talent pool, and it has many more practitioners who are willing to put in the hard work. There are more authentic instructors around the world with real fight experience.

    While Sanshou (especially in the West) is still very young, and there are a lot of people teaching it who come from traditional kung fu backgrounds but don't have any true full contact fighting experience.

    Some people start out in Sanshou, but move on to Muay Thai or K-1 style kickboxing because of the lack of career opportunities available (Pat Barry for example). It's also a lot easier to get fights in Kickboxing or Muay Thai than Sanshou, so a lot of Sanshou fighters cross-compete or switch over completely.

    But I've been to the World Championships, and trust me, there are some very young elite athletes with arguably better sanshou skills than Cung. If I had the resources, I'd find ways to get these guys to build up their professional careers and enter MMA.

    Both styles are great, and everyone should just train at the gym they enjoy the most, and learn the most from.
  8. BTMT28 is offline

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    Posted On:
    4/07/2012 12:54pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: Muay Thai, MMA, Boxing

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    Muay Thai harder training sanda is also very good at clinch takedowns.
  9. Matt Phillips is online now
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    NOTE TO SELF - MOAR GRAPPLE - GET A NORMAL HAIR CUT - REPEAT

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    Posted On:
    4/07/2012 1:37pm

    supporting member
     Style: Submission Grappling

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    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    San Shou does not have knees or elbows; ring SanDa allows knees, and has a version that allows elbows if pads are worn.

    Someday someone will figure out that a certain popular round kick catch in Sanda feeds beautifully into a heel hook, and it will be a minor game changer (IMO)
    Now darkness comes; you don't know if the whales are coming. - Royce Gracie


    KosherKickboxer has t3h r34l chi sao

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  10. hitme000 is offline

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    Posted On:
    5/06/2012 9:06pm

    Bullshido Newbie
     Style: shorin ryu karate, MMA

    --
    Hell yeah! Hell no!
    sanda dose use elbows and knees as well i belivie it can be more practical for the street than muay thai and also better in the cage because of the takes downs as well. no offense to muay thai
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